Gun control / Anti gun control

[gunslinger]

Gun control is just control of the populace, nothing more. The main reason for the second amendment is so WE can protect ourselves from ever increasing govenment power.

Here are some facts:

1. "Gun Control" only affects the law abiding. Criminals naturally disobey laws, hence the name criminal.

2. According to the FBI site on crime statistics, more people are killed with blunt objects than rifles of all types. Notice I said rifles of ALL types. This includes so called assault rifles. In 2011, 496 people were murdered with a hammer or a blunt object compare to just 323 murders that were committed with a rifle. Blunt objects also beat out the number of murders committed with a shotgun which was 356.

3. Also according to this website, handguns account for 6,220 deaths and knives account for 1,694 deaths.

4. The term assault rifle came from Hitler. It is a translation of the German word Sturmgewehr (Storm Rifle). This was in reference to their machine pistol which they used to "storm" enemy positions. The name itself instilled fear. Hence the reason it is used so frequently by politicians and the media in their subversion tactics.

5. According to the US Army. In order for a rifle to be an "assault Rifle" it must be a "short, compact, selective-fire weapon that fires a cartridge intermediate in power between submachinegun and rifle cartridges." The key word here is selective fire, meaning it can fire in full auto mode. The media will also distort the truth by calling semiauto handguns automatic handguns or auto loading handguns.

6. The second amendment was written so we would be able to defend ourselves with weapons similar to the military. If it was just muskets they were refering to then they would have said muskets and not arms.

To finish, it is my firm belief that they are after these "assault weapons" to make it easier for them to take the other weapons, take the second amendment and then take the rest of our rights. Because the second amendment guarantees us the rest of our rights.

Besides, if criminals really want weapons all they have to do is ask Eric Holder.

I almost forgot, the staunchest supporters of "gun control" (New York, California, Chicago) have the strictest gun laws but yet the most murders from rest of the states.

Great post! Nice to see there are still a few people on here with some common sense. Its very refreshing in a sea of ignorant, yet cocky ass holes.

 

[Freedom PC Solutions]

Great post! Nice to see there are still a few people on here with some common sense. Its very refreshing in a sea of ignorant, yet cocky ass holes.

Thanks. Some opinions that others have just blow my mind.

For instance, a family friend said on Facebook that gun owners and enthusiasts should be forced to go to rehab and hospitals to see the damage their firearms are causing. She goes on to say that it worked for M.A.D.D. and drunk drivers when she was in school.

So making lawful gun owners who have not shot anyone, see the damage criminals are doing is going to do what exactly?

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

1. "Gun Control" only affects the law abiding. Criminals naturally disobey laws, hence the name criminal.

It's almost comical.... the degree that the above simple and concise point manages to zoom over the head of most people.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

For instance, a family friend said on Facebook that gun owners and enthusiasts should be forced to go to rehab and hospitals to see the damage their firearms are causing. She goes on to say that it worked for M.A.D.D. and drunk drivers when she was in school.

So making lawful gun owners who have not shot anyone, see the damage criminals are doing is going to do what exactly?

That's the same type that would throw buckets of fake blood on me because I sliced up some venison and made an excellent venison/wild mushroom and barley stew this afternoon. Oh yeah...I saw the damage the gun did to the deer too.

 

[Xander]

Clearly the gun laws are working just fine down there. We went, what, almost a week or so without another mass-shooting in the States?

A 15-year-old boy has been charged with the murder of two adults and three children, the Bernalillo County Sheriff’s Office said.

Last night, police found five people dead at a South Valley home in the 2800 block of Long Lane SW.

A man, a woman, two girls and a boy were found in the home with several gunshot wounds.

Shortly after 1 p.m. police identified the 15-year-old as Nehemiah Griego.

Police believe the teenager used an AR-15 semi automatic rifle in the shooting. Multiple weapons were retrieved from the house.

On the plus side, there were plenty of weapons in the house so they should have all been able and ready to defend themselves, right?

 

[HFultzjr]

Yeah, 17 pages later I can't even remember, but I have no problem with this. You don't need a machine gun -style buttload of ammo just to kill a deer...in fact, if you really know what you're doing, you can do it with a bow and arrow, just like the natives did. They had no other methods and did just fine. It's possible. Huge clips are just not necessary.

Also, HFultzjr, if your point was to portray Michael Moore as one of your own, you are sadly mistaken. While I actually agree with what Moore wrote, he's not going to be coming to the gun nut side anytime soon. I READ his entire post, did you? Because you pasted in what I already pasted from Moore last month.

All the strenuous gun defenders here might be surprised to see the things we probably agree on with the issue if they just paused the indignant nastiness for a moment.

As I sit here laughing my ass off.......Thanks TechLady!

The part about not using a gun, but a bow, is probably the most stupid comment I've heard yet.

Please....sit back, relax, take a couple of deep breaths and PLEASE READ WHAT YOU ARE WRITING BEFORE HITTING THE SEND BUTTON.

Excuse me, but I must go sharpen my spear....I hear a prowler.

Lovin it!

 

[HFultzjr]

As I sit here laughing my ass off.......Thanks TechLady!

The part about not using a gun, but a bow, is probably the most stupid comment I've heard yet.

Please....sit back, relax, take a couple of deep breaths and PLEASE READ WHAT YOU ARE WRITING BEFORE HITTING THE SEND BUTTON.

Excuse me, but I must go sharpen my spear....I hear a prowler.

Lovin it!

TechLady,

As I've come to quit laughing at your last comment, I wish to apologize for making a joke of your ignorance.

Sorry!!!!!!!

 

[HFultzjr]

That's the same type that would throw buckets of fake blood on me because I sliced up some venison and made an excellent venison/wild mushroom and barley stew this afternoon. Oh yeah...I saw the damage the gun did to the deer too.

YeOldeStonecat,

You're making me hungry! I bagged a 10pt. this year also.

Oooops....I got off topic.

Don't want to get THAT thread going.

Back to the topic at hand.

 

[compnet]

This isnt necessarily pro or anti gun, but where were all the people supposedly protecting the constitution with their guns when we lost habeus corpus and the right to privacy.. Surely the thought of the cia snooping in on your calls and taking you in the dead of night to be sodomized and tortured without a trial and based on bad intel would be enough for you to rally up your well regulated militia and take back our freedom all william wallace style.. Maybe if the assault rifle ban goes through?

What's that? You're just going to continue in a far left vs far right argument and insult people that in all reality have 0 to do with the laws being made? Oh ok then, carry on. God forbid we as a people come together to do something about our completely corrupt and inefficient government.. Let's all concentrate on our differences and fight amongst ourselves while the powers that be continue to make laws and run our country for their own interests.

You know what, lets take it one step further and post with such hate and vitriol towards those that dont share the same mindset as us, that we can further the idea that politics or any conversation with a shred of substance be left out of the workplace or any casual setting.. no no no, these are subjects best discussed between close friends that you already know share the same beliefs. That way nobody gets their feelings hurt, and everyone can keep their narrow filtered beliefs from your choice of BS media outlets..

Well, thats all for now.. I'll see you all when the next distraction from whats really going on pops up.

 

[Xander]

This crossed my mind as I was on a different site which was discussing the shooting I just posted about.....

If your average gun nut's reason for arming himself is the possibility of a corrupt government and your American elections don't tend to have landslide elections anymore but ones a lot closer to 49/51 then that means that the citizenry who are arming themselves are really only arming themselves against the other half of the citizenry who are arming themselves because that half already supports the government that is in place. The military strength is irrelevant and it's really just a matter of crackpots who want to shoot their red/blue neighbours.

 

[gunslinger]

It's almost comical.... the degree that the above simple and concise point manages to zoom over the head of most people.

The degree of ignorance is absolutely amazing. Especially when coming from otherwise "intelligent people"

As I sit here laughing my ass off.......Thanks TechLady!
The part about not using a gun, but a bow, is probably the most stupid comment I've heard yet.
Please....sit back, relax, take a couple of deep breaths and PLEASE READ WHAT YOU ARE WRITING BEFORE HITTING THE SEND BUTTON.
Excuse me, but I must go sharpen my spear....I hear a prowler.
Lovin it!

Its is stupid to the Point of being hilarious.
This is what we are dealing with here...lol

The more this goes on the less respect I have for certain members. Its sad that people can be so smart in some things and complete idiots in others. And before we get the fence riders in here, yes, there is a right and wrong here and its not a matter of opinion.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

When it comes to gun control you have two types of people. The ones who are controlled by the right wing media and wish to remain ignorant of actual logic or facts and the ones who actually control the media and know full well the ultimate goal is justification of arming of the citizenry so they can go into foreign lands for oil and murder hundreds of thousands of civilians.

If you have a single gun in your house, you can say your are protecting your family. If you feel the need to stockpile weapons, you are preparing to kill people; you just haven't decided who yet.

Such a typical example of a self mal-informed stereotype. Bet you'd be surprised how many of your friends and neighbors actually have a "stockpile" as you say, of guns. Ever hear of "collecting?" Lots of law abiding good mentally sound citizens enjoy collecting. My dad has a good collection of target pistols when I was a kid growing up, he competed in lots of indoor target competitions and had lots of trophies. Very upstanding good person. My neighbor had a whole mancave setup in his house with rows and rows of hunting and skeet rifles, shotguns, and quite a few handguns. Very very very well known guy around town and of one of the founding historic families of fishermen. I learned a lot from this guy.....he was like a second father to me. One of my fond memories of him, he took me to the gun range (many times)..but one particular trip he allowed me the incredible honor of spending the afternoon shooting an M1 Garand Rifle. A rifle with incredible history behind it...and that traces its birth to your country of Canada. 2x more houses down that street I grew up on, my friend that was 3 years older than me...he had a big collection of quirky guns...before he was even 21 years old! Including an AR-15. And a full automatic (home made). 25 years later he's still a good friend of mine that live about 30 minutes away with a lovely wife and lovely daughter and an awesome job in underwater marine salvage and construction, as well as a dive instructor.

When I was in law enforcement, you know how many other officers had a decent size collection, and enjoyed spending lots of time at the gun range? I remember my Captain having an affection for knocking down rabbits at one particular outdoor gun range that had a crazy rabbit competition...doesn't mean he started envisioning innocent citizens.

BUT...according to your mal-informed ways....all these people will be sociopaths that are doomed to mow down innocents in a bloodbath.

Clearly the gun laws are working just fine down there. We went, what, almost a week or so without another mass-shooting in the States?
On the plus side, there were plenty of weapons in the house so they should have all been able and ready to defend themselves, right?

The US holds 3rd place in the world for highest population...over 315 million. So really.....you're going to be that ignorant and make a claim of "another week another gun crime?" and yet the common sense that the US has ~10x the population of Canada thus a higher frequency of crimes escapes you?

That incident you refer to in New Mexico above....why not dig into the facts about that household. The father in that household was a big time gang member....yes claimed to be "ex" and self turned pastor to try to be a "do-gooder" and convert other gang members. According to some media, lots of gang members and problem kids and ex inmates would stay there. IMO, the environment of the head of household being an ex gang member, plus staying close to other gang members and ex inmates....is not a good environment to raise a family. You're inviting trouble. I'd wager that no guns that house were registered or legal. You really thing gang types will have legal weapons? It is reported that the kid was good too....that he was a rambo-mercenary wanna-be that wore Camo army fatigues every day...literally every day.

I applaud that fathers conversion from gang member to a pastor type that tried to convert other gang members out of the life. However..due to that role, and due to having people stay at this house, like it was a half-way house....that is NO environment to raise a family in. It is a ticking time-bomb. He should have not allowed his family to be exposed to that, surely that boy had lots of negative influence on him. History always comes back to bite you in the arse. He, his wife, and other kids...paid the price for that decision.

We've yet to see the details of how those guns were obtained.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

To make some points to ponder...

*Something like 40% of the guns "legally owned/registered"...were purchased second hand (meaning used). Now..considering that this statistic is covering guns used by law enforcement (offices are usually given new guns), and the military (similar)...that leaves us with the average citizen that has registered guns having a much larger % of them being purchased used/second hand. Through venues like gun shows and collector shows. Which...often allows things to slip through the cracks. Second hand also means...ability to purchase weapons that were made and originally sold prior to bans.

*And now for something even more interesting to think about. Has anyone heard of "3D Printers"? There was already publish "proof of concept" experiment done, where someone made an AR-15 rifle using some key parts that were constructed in a 3D Printer...and the gun worked for a few rounds before it broke. One person...on their first try....made one that survived shooting a few rounds. I'm sure with more and more attempts and redesign, one that will work well will be made (if not already...one can be assured many criminals are already working on this at a feverish pace).

 

[SilverLeaf]

*And now for something even more interesting to think about. Has anyone heard of "3D Printers"? There was already publish "proof of concept" experiment done, where someone made an AR-15 rifle using some key parts that were constructed in a 3D Printer...and the gun worked for a few rounds before it broke. One person...on their first try....made one that survived shooting a few rounds. I'm sure with more and more attempts and redesign, one that will work well will be made (if not already...one can be assured many criminals are already working on this at a feverish pace).

I wondered when this would be mentioned. There is actually an open source weapons project. http://defensedistributed.com/

 

[Jura]

I think gun owners should be listed on a website and made unable to live near schools/parks.

 

[Martyn]

I think gun owners should be listed on a website and made unable to live near schools/parks.

Surely this is a joke?

 

[alluseridsrejected]

I wondered when this would be mentioned. There is actually an open source weapons project. http://defensedistributed.com/

I actually mentioned it towards the bottom of the 1st page of this thread, but if you want to see this new technology really accelerate and develop at the speed of light then just start banning guns.

 

[Jura]

It's not. And the part about guns in the constitution is only there because states that had slavery wanted militia to keep slaves from escaping and rebelling. Those states were less likely to pass it if it wasn't included.

 

[angry_geek]

I think gun owners should be listed on a website and made unable to live near schools/parks.

I've stayed fairly quiet in this discussion, but this statement made me want to say something. It was difficult to pull off, but you have officially made the single most idiotic post in this entire thread. You should be proud.

Here's a quote from my old debate coach that I keep in mind: "Trying to debate with some people is like having a conversation with a donkey. They don't contribute anything to the discussion, but they surely will make a lot of noise and are very likely to piss and s*** all over the floor."

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

I think gun owners should be listed on a website and made unable to live near schools/parks.

Please..publish mine. What you're doing is actually making my home safer...less likely to be broken into. You see...bad guys are less likely to do a home invasion or rob a home..if they know the home owner is armed. Just in case they missed the sign in my front yard saying "This home is protected by Smith &Wesson"

However..consider the flip side...if you publish a listing of names/addresses of gun owners, you also ADVERTISE the names and addresses of unprotected homes. Now...you see...bad guys, crooks..they prey on the weak, not the strong. So now they have a list of homes that are most likely not protected by a gun owner. Hey...it's open season on them for home invasions and bad things to happen to the wife and daughters. Good job to those that helped publish this list...I hope they sleep soundly...knowing that they just enabled the burglary/home invasion of innocent people that opted not to arm themselves at home!

Hard facts...not opinion..but published actual facts (from FBI)
Property Crime Facts (According to the FBI in the US: www.fbi.gov):

One property crime happens every 3 seconds.
One burglary occurs every 10 seconds.
One violent crime occurs every 20 seconds.
One aggravated assault occurs every 35 seconds.
One robbery occurs every 60 seconds, or 1 minute.
One forcible rape occurs every 2 minutes.
There were over 2 million burglaries in 2005.
An increase in burglary offenses was the only property crime to increase in 2005 compared with the prior year data.
Home Invasion Facts:

According to a United States Department of Justice report:
38% of assaults & 60% of rapes occur during home invasions.
1 of every 5 homes will experience a break-in or home invasion. That's over 2,000,000 homes!
According to Statistics Canada, there has been an average of 289,200 home invasions annually over the last 5 years.
Statistically, there are over 8,000 home invasions per day in North America
According to Statistics U.S.A., there was an average of 3,600,000 home invasions annually between 1994 and 2000.

I live literally across the street from the elementary school that my 9 year old daughter goes to. Her safety at home, and at the school, is at the top of my mind.