I've Gone Through THREE Routers in a Month!

sapphirescales

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Okay, personal problem here. I've gone through three different routers in a month; a $300 ASUS, a $90 Netgear, and a $240 Linksys. They've all failed in exactly the same way - Everything on the 2.4Ghz band slows down to an absolute crawl. Speed test shows 0.5Mbps if I can keep it connected for that long. I'm talking the Alexa's take 20+ seconds just to turn the light on or off, and it fails half the time. The 5Ghz band continues working flawlessly on every one of these routers. Is it possible I have a defective device on my network that's frying routers? Yes, I've completely reset the modem/router to factory defaults. It doesn't help. This is definitely a hardware problem (unless you can come up with some other explanation). Anyone ever experience this?

EDIT: Oh and it's not too many devices connected to that band. I already thought of that. I have 35 devices connected to the 2.4Ghz band and about 20 devices connected to the 5Ghz band. If it was something like that then the router wouldn't work perfectly for a week before crapping out on me. I've tried different channels too. FWIW, these are all WiFi 6 routers.

EDIT 2: Oh yeah, and out of desperation I also swapped my modem one time. It did nothing.
 
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There are SO many variables with wifi. What is your environment like, how crowded is the 2.4 spectrum? Wifi 6 is new, and I'm not aware of any special setup guidelines, but is it possible something in the configuration throttles 2.4 in favor of 5g? I haven't done any Wifi6 setups yet, but I'm seeing one of my "early adopter" residential clients on Thursday to talk about upgrading his 3500 sq ft house - I'm dreading it, frankly -haha.
 
Gotta love it when techs throw parts at the wall to see what sticks instead of troubleshooting the problem.

The nature of Wifi is such that ANY DEVICE communicating on the frequencies in use slows down the ENTIRE SET of devices on that spectrum.

So your neighbor can have a buggy device within range of your WAP and cause this. I've seen all sorts of other things do it too, microwaves, bad ballasts on florescent lights, you name it.

All of this is why I use DEDICATED WAPs in my home and all of my customers offices. I use Unifi gear specifically, not that I think they're terribly good, I'm just really familiar with them. And those devices have the TOOLS YOU NEED to SEE THESE ISSUES and fix them. Something you'll never get with a consumer crap router.

Which honestly, I cannot fathom how or why anyone would pay $300 for that garbage. That's higher than the low end of actual professional equipment, and nowhere near as good.
 
I have seen this happen numerous times on 2.4ghz and it was always interference or noise on the frequency. Like stoncat said, there are only 3 non overlapping 20ghz channels available. I always run an app on my phone called "Wifi Analyzer" and if possible select a different frequency. If you are non in a crowded area you may be able to find a new frequency, but that might only be temporary until another device picks the same one you are on.
 
The logical next step is to run a wireless site survey. Quick 'n easy to do!
The 2.4 radio is limited to 3x non-overlapping channels.
LOTS of other devices also crowd the 2.4 channels...not just wifi clients. Sooooo.....yeah, run a site survey..arm yourself with knowledge first.
What do you use for surveys?
 
Okay, personal problem here. I've gone through three different routers in a month; a $300 ASUS, a $90 Netgear, and a $240 Linksys. They've all failed in exactly the same way - Everything on the 2.4Ghz band slows down to an absolute crawl. Speed test shows 0.5Mbps if I can keep it connected for that long. I'm talking the Alexa's take 20+ seconds just to turn the light on or off, and it fails half the time. The 5Ghz band continues working flawlessly on every one of these routers. Is it possible I have a defective device on my network that's frying routers? Yes, I've completely reset the modem/router to factory defaults. It doesn't help. This is definitely a hardware problem (unless you can come up with some other explanation). Anyone ever experience this?

EDIT: Oh and it's not too many devices connected to that band. I already thought of that. I have 35 devices connected to the 2.4Ghz band and about 20 devices connected to the 5Ghz band. If it was something like that then the router wouldn't work perfectly for a week before crapping out on me. I've tried different channels too. FWIW, these are all WiFi 6 routers.

EDIT 2: Oh yeah, and out of desperation I also swapped my modem one time. It did nothing.
Hi @sapphirescales

1st, directly connect a laptop to the ISP gateway's ethernet port. Run a speed test. Make sure then speed delivered is as expected (paying for) if not, schedule an on prem service call with ISP. Make them hit the speed SLA while you watch.

I use Unifi personally. I next prefer the Netgear WAX or switches or Orbi Pro (better VLAN management)

I wish Unifi were more timely on Wi-Fi 6 but maybe that is a blessing. I decided to run down their rabbit hole when I had too many clients using Unifi and I could not configure them. So I decided to invest and learn their stack. The best feature is their free controller software. Very helpful with your type of issue. Others give you trial cloud access and some reporting but then pull you into a fee based program.

I'm sure you've verified the obvious. Here are somethings I've come across that may affect throughput/connectivity

1) Do you have any wireless access points in your configuration? If yes that's a whole other ball of wax but make sure they're at least uplinked using a wire. Wireless uplinks are really sketchy.

2) Do you have any of the nasty, early generation ring cams doorbells? Same for any camera system really if they are constantly streaming. If yes, I would temporarily remove those from the network and optimize configuration. Then add back.

I have found that ring devices simply bounce between all the possible access points ultimately trying to get all ring devices on the same access point (Not sure why.)

3) What Wi-fi channels are you using for 2.4G, 5G Low and 5G High radio bands? You may only have on 5G band. If you can use one of the 5G bands for back haul, do so. ASUS and Netgear allows for this.

I read a good whitepaper from Cisco on their Meraki platform. Their Step #1, is to decide what channels to use for each access point. If you only have one access point, the router, then you need to select one for each Radio Band.

4) Which channel to use? Do not turn on auto wifi (AI) tuning. Use a different channel for each each access point radio. Avoid channel duplication where possible

2.4Gh prob avoid channel 1. In the US you only have 1, 6 and 11.

5Ghz use one channel in low range 36-64 and one in high range 144-161.

In US, if you use a channel between b/t 100 and 128, the Govt may automatically, but temporarily, disconnect/block your access if they need that channel for radar purposes. Like an airport or military base near by. Just avoid this range

Pick the least congested channel and if the info is available, the channel that introduces the least Rx/Tx packet retries for your clients often introduced by your OTHER ACCESS POINTS (see signal strength)

Use a signal meter. Don't worry, I'm not thinking you'll go spend a $1k for one. On Android there is Wi-Fi analyzer see pic 1 On iOs, I'm sure there are several. On a PC, I find WifiInfoView by nirsoft useful.

With these apps, they will show what channels are heavily used see pic 2. Now I have lots of access points. But even if you just have a router, it's signal and that of your neighbors will show up. The LESS negative the dB the stronger the signal (grade school negative whole integers) or simply, the taller the curve.

Channel Width
2.4GHz set to HT to 20. 5Ghz set VHT to 40

Signal Strength.

If multiple access points, reduce the signal strength (EIRP) to perhaps +15dB to +19dB
If signal is too strong (set to max) your devices will bounce back and forth between access points causing Rx/Tx retries. I often think of this being analogous to a CPU which thrashes as it spends all of it's time swapping memory and little time processing

Band Steering
Yes please. Push 5G to 5G. Let 2.4Ghz devices wallow in the gutter. You may have to create 2 SSID's to separate those radio bands.

Even though the 5Ghz signal "appears" weaker to your clients (and then incorrectly selects a 2GHz signal), your actual throughput is likely better on 5GHz say 500-600Mbps than 2.4ghz (Max Mbps 150-200) This is why you want to use band steering to force eligible clients to 5Ghz - doesn't always work.

On Unifi, I made the mistake of using "smart queues?" which automatically reduces the throughout for all clients because it anticipates overall congestion even if there is a lot of bandwidth. I got rid of that and now back to expected speeds.

Wired devices. If you have a poorly matched ISP gateway, VPN or switch, etc. upstream from access points or in front of router, that can easily gate throughput. Make sure that is not the case. Read specs and see what max packets are.

Sniffing (DPI). If the router is evaluating every packet for threats or behaviors, then the router is also providing BIG Data stats. I like DPI, threat management, not so much.. The router must have the quality of hardware and software to make that actually work.
 

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You could always build a faraday cage so other networks don't overlap yours. Sure it blocks everything but then, why not...

I'm half kidding and half not. If only there was some material to reduce specific wavelengths of radio waves, then you could reduce interference.
 
Smart queues is actually smart to use with Unifi.
Smart queues is bandwidth management/QoS (quality of service). Keeps a user(s) from hogging the bandwidth. Yes, you don't get that big fancy fat bar graph or tachometer reading on some mostly fake online speed test...but who cares? Run a speedtest with SQ disabled if you want to purely run online speed tests for some giggle factor...but turn it back on if you have more than a handful of devices....to keep things fair for all players. And that.....is the point...of bandwidth management.
His issues, as he stated, were only with the 2.4 radio, as the 5.0 ran fine. So that narrow it down to the 2.4 in his immediate area.

I use Ubiquitis own WiFiMan on my smart phone...it's the best freebie smart phone app I've seen (and I've seen a lot). Gives a lot of useful info once you dig into it.
For my laptop, an older fully functional version of inSSIDer...before they neutered the free version and added ads.
 
You could always build a faraday cage so other networks don't overlap yours. Sure it blocks everything but then, why not...

This is my house. :( It was one of the earlier houses to use aluminum siding long ago ('50s) before I bought it. They used to add a bit of copper to the aluminum back then to make it more ductile. Cell phone signals just die inside my house. I'm lucky to get WiFi in the garage 25 ft. away.
 
This is my house. :( It was one of the earlier houses to use aluminum siding long ago ('50s) before I bought it. They used to add a bit of copper to the aluminum back then to make it more ductile. Cell phone signals just die inside my house. I'm lucky to get WiFi in the garage 25 ft. away.
We have homes all over the place out here that do that, except it's thanks to chicken wire backing used to hold up the stucco exterior.

Thankfully most companies have swapped out for a different wire mesh as a substrate, but older homes with that chicken wire... not sure why but the annihilates 2.4ghz!
 
Well guys, I've turned off all AX features and that seems to have solved the problem. Looks like WiFi 6 just isn't ready for prime time. Out of my 55 devices or so only 2 or 3 of them even have WiFi 6 so I guess I jumped the gun a little. It's just really strange that everything works great for a week or so until it all goes to hell.
 
Smart queues is actually smart to use with Unifi.
Smart queues is bandwidth management/QoS (quality of service). Keeps a user(s) from hogging the bandwidth. Yes, you don't get that big fancy fat bar graph or tachometer reading on some mostly fake online speed test...but who cares? Run a speedtest with SQ disabled if you want to purely run online speed tests for some giggle factor...but turn it back on if you have more than a handful of devices....to keep things fair for all players. And that.....is the point...of bandwidth management.
His issues, as he stated, were only with the 2.4 radio, as the 5.0 ran fine. So that narrow it down to the 2.4 in his immediate area.

I use Ubiquitis own WiFiMan on my smart phone...it's the best freebie smart phone app I've seen (and I've seen a lot). Gives a lot of useful info once you dig into it.
For my laptop, an older fully functional version of inSSIDer...before they neutered the free version and added ads.
I appreciate your POV though I'd need a real case where congestion is such that I can observe benefit of SQ (QoS). At home, my wife and I do not create enough congestion for SQ to be meaningful. Since the logic used by UI is a black box, hard to evaluate in the hypothetical.
 
It's not so much "black box"...since Unifi runs on linux (it's basically Vyatta under the hood, which is a special twist on Debian focusing on routing)....it leverages fq_codel, can really help manage things like "ping time"...and avoid buffer bloat. Even for a small network of a handful of devices...what's nice about it, say someone is streaming music or video, or playing an online video game....while another person might be feverishly downloading large files...it keeps the impact of the person downloading large files from causing the video to hang, or from causing big time lag for the person playing an online game. When I was big into online gaming, and my son was still young and into hitting torrenting heavily for his music, his constant downloading (and uploading) via torrent never bothered my online gaming. If you have VoIP phones also...it helps nicely. Those are some of the advantages...versus...sitting there running online speed tests all day long just to see the tachometer/bar graph peak out.
 
I remember back in the good 'ole days when people upgraded their routers thinking they would unlock what max speed the router claimed. Only for me as a tech to tell them that Wifi A/B would max out even (at the time) the most speedy consumer line. (Assuming line of site, ideal conditions etc) The only real advantage was if you had two machine sharing data between them with no Internet as a man in the middle.
 
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