Pirates Suck

[rogerthehart]

Pirates Suck.

Please note - I am posting this to several lists/forums in hopes I will get some answers.

Another routine job - 1 desktop machine that won't boot, another that is way out of date, and 3 laptops that need updates.

Good friends from my church - their former "computer guy" took a job somewhere and so they called me to replace him.

So I replaced the HD in the non-booting PC; cloned with Acronis goes fine; chkdsk /r to fix up the filesystem. Then I start the updates.

Long story short (too late), both desktop machines are running XP pro with pirated keys; both desktops plus 1 laptop are running pirated Office. Now, used to be Microsoft allowed users to get genuine XP with this problem for $149. Now they only offer Windows 7 in the "Get Genuine Kit," and neither of these desktops are fit to run Windows 7.

So I finished updating and went home to order some software: 2 OEM XP Pro (2 different ebay sellers) and 1 retail Office 2003 (Amazon marketplace). I got a great deal paying $60 for each XP disc and $72 for Office 2003 Professional Retail full. (Strange #1) I assummed I was getting a deal based on them being old versions.

Friday I was all set to get all of these taken care of and get them genuinely licensed. So I removed the pirated Office installations from all three and started doing repair installs on both desktops with my XP SP3 OEM disc. I also started a reinstall of Office on the laptop with my new boxed copy. Everything went well until it was time to type in the product key. Both gave me "Invalid Product Key". Strange (#2) - never had a problem with this disc before. I assumed newer OEM copies might not match the one I made a couple of years ago from my SP1a disc. So I shut down the machines and opened each new disc to do the repair this time. When I got to the product key with the first machine, it worked; but there was no activation prompt - strange (#3)

All three pieces of software I obtained are counterfeit. There are many details that tipped me off (see www.howtotell.com):
1. Spelling/Capitalization errors
a. The Office 2003 book in the clamshell reads "Discovering the Microsoft Office 2003 EditionS" with the capital S at the end.
b. The Office 2003 box lists "WWW.microsoft.com" as the web url in one place
c. The Office 2003 product key is listed as "PRODUCTKEY" with no space
d. "data" is spelled "daga" on the back of the Office 2003 box
2. Copying errors. There is a book included in the Office 2003 box. It has very poor quality screenshots and sometimes they cover up portions of the text.
3. All discs have labels - the hologram is not built into the discs as MS states they should be.
4. Windows COAs fail visual inspection when compared to MS site
5. Windows discs have the wrong disc label - instead of VRMPOEM_EN they read VRMPFPP_EN and GRTPFPP_EN
6. 1 Windows CD has SP3 on it when the disc itself says Service Pack 2.
...and many other details.

Some lessons I learned that I should have already known:
1. Never assume anything. It makes an a$$ out of you and me - mostly just me.
2. Never, ever trust the former computer guy's work. There's probably a good reason he's not doing it any more.
3. If it's too good to be true, it probably is. I thought I was getting a steal with the prices I found on that software. I sure was. Now I'm out $200 and have 3 pieces of counterfeit software.
4. Double- and triple-check all "genuine" media and packaging before installing on a customer's machine

So what do I do now? I now have both desktops back to their pre-repair status - both still with pirated keys. How do I get them genuine? How do I get my money back for the counterfeit software? Will Microsoft reimburse me when I report it (and I will)? Anybody else have these problems before? How did you fix? I've been tearing my hair out and I am very angry about the whole situation.

 

[Hooked]

Pirates Suck.

Please note - I am posting this to several lists/forums in hopes I will get some answers.

Another routine job - 1 desktop machine that won't boot, another that is way out of date, and 3 laptops that need updates.

Good friends from my church - their former "computer guy" took a job somewhere and so they called me to replace him.

So I replaced the HD in the non-booting PC; cloned with Acronis goes fine; chkdsk /r to fix up the filesystem. Then I start the updates.

Long story short (too late), both desktop machines are running XP pro with pirated keys; both desktops plus 1 laptop are running pirated Office. Now, used to be Microsoft allowed users to get genuine XP with this problem for $149. Now they only offer Windows 7 in the "Get Genuine Kit," and neither of these desktops are fit to run Windows 7.

So I finished updating and went home to order some software: 2 OEM XP Pro (2 different ebay sellers) and 1 retail Office 2003 (Amazon marketplace). I got a great deal paying $60 for each XP disc and $72 for Office 2003 Professional Retail full. (Strange #1) I assummed I was getting a deal based on them being old versions.

Friday I was all set to get all of these taken care of and get them genuinely licensed. So I removed the pirated Office installations from all three and started doing repair installs on both desktops with my XP SP3 OEM disc. I also started a reinstall of Office on the laptop with my new boxed copy. Everything went well until it was time to type in the product key. Both gave me "Invalid Product Key". Strange (#2) - never had a problem with this disc before. I assumed newer OEM copies might not match the one I made a couple of years ago from my SP1a disc. So I shut down the machines and opened each new disc to do the repair this time. When I got to the product key with the first machine, it worked; but there was no activation prompt - strange (#3)

All three pieces of software I obtained are counterfeit. There are many details that tipped me off (see www.howtotell.com):
1. Spelling/Capitalization errors
a. The Office 2003 book in the clamshell reads "Discovering the Microsoft Office 2003 EditionS" with the capital S at the end.
b. The Office 2003 box lists "WWW.microsoft.com" as the web url in one place
c. The Office 2003 product key is listed as "PRODUCTKEY" with no space
d. "data" is spelled "daga" on the back of the Office 2003 box
2. Copying errors. There is a book included in the Office 2003 box. It has very poor quality screenshots and sometimes they cover up portions of the text.
3. All discs have labels - the hologram is not built into the discs as MS states they should be.
4. Windows COAs fail visual inspection when compared to MS site
5. Windows discs have the wrong disc label - instead of VRMPOEM_EN they read VRMPFPP_EN and GRTPFPP_EN
6. 1 Windows CD has SP3 on it when the disc itself says Service Pack 2.
...and many other details.

Some lessons I learned that I should have already known:
1. Never assume anything. It makes an a$$ out of you and me - mostly just me.
2. Never, ever trust the former computer guy's work. There's probably a good reason he's not doing it any more.
3. If it's too good to be true, it probably is. I thought I was getting a steal with the prices I found on that software. I sure was. Now I'm out $200 and have 3 pieces of counterfeit software.
4. Double- and triple-check all "genuine" media and packaging before installing on a customer's machine

So what do I do now? I now have both desktops back to their pre-repair status - both still with pirated keys. How do I get them genuine? How do I get my money back for the counterfeit software? Will Microsoft reimburse me when I report it (and I will)? Anybody else have these problems before? How did you fix? I've been tearing my hair out and I am very angry about the whole situation.

eBay has seller ratings for a reason.

 

[vdub12]

I have ran in to the same dilemma a few times lately.

Its getting to the point that the only fix is buy a new computer. It sucks and its loosing me lots of money but you just can't get genuine copy's of XP anymore and Windows 7 will not run on these older systems.

How does Microsoft expect people to use genuine software if they don't provide it for sale. I think we are going to see this more and more in the near future and honestly I think its going to make the piracy problem worse because many techs are going to get sick off loosing money.

I guess the alternative is to build systems but there is no way to compete with the OEM's. Also its very unprofessional sounding to tell a customer that the only fix is to replace the computer when the pizza tech down the street will install a pirate copy that will pass WGA for $50. I have had a few customers downright think I was trying to rip them off and I think it gives us "genuine" techs a bad name.

I guess theres always Linux.

 

[Thedog]

Why didnt you just tell the client that they had pirated versions and the only way to fix it was either to get Windows 7 OR INSTALL a crack (wga-fix etc)? And also explain that the disadvantage with the crack is that their OS would stay illegal and Microsoft might release some update that makes it go back to not genuine?

 

[MM PC Solutions]

OR INSTALL a crack (wga-fix etc)? And also explain that the disadvantage with the crack is that their OS would stay illegal and Microsoft might release some update that makes it go back to not genuine?

Nope, never do this. Apart from the legality, it will go wrong at some stage in the future and it will be all the technicians fault!

 

[Thedog]

Nope, never do this. Apart from the legality, it will go wrong at some stage in the future and it will be all the technicians fault!

That's why you tell the client that it might only be a temporary solution. And Im not sure about what stage in the future. Both me and friends have used such cracks which have been working for years...

 

[MobileTechie]

Obviously it can work but it's not legal. If your competitors found out and reported you, you could be facing a prosecution. Personally I don't think it's worth the risk. I'm not a stickler for licencing but this seems a like the sort of blatent offence that should be avoided.

To the OP: you're not out $200 if you raise complaints with Amazon and Paypal. i'd be surprised if they don't refund you immediately. They are not allowed to benefit from piracy. I've bought counterfeit goods off ebay and got my money back with no problems.

There are plenty of places to buy legit copies of XP from. Just don't expect to get a super bargain.

 

[Alan22]

2. Never, ever trust the former computer guy's work. There's probably a good reason he's not doing it any more.
Oh please. In my experience there are more honest technicians out there than dishonest ones.

3. If it's too good to be true, it probably is. I thought I was getting a steal with the prices I found on that software. I sure was. Now I'm out $200 and have 3 pieces of counterfeit software.
That I'll agree with. $60 for each XP disc - yeah, right. The price is the first tipoff & where it was obtained is the second. I've seen good pricing on legit Office 2003 though.

4. Double- and triple-check all "genuine" media and packaging before installing on a customer's machine
And also buy from legitimate sources.

So what do I do now? I now have both desktops back to their pre-repair status - both still with pirated keys. How do I get them genuine?
Purchase valid licenses from trustworthy sources.

How do I get my money back for the counterfeit software?
You're kidding, right? Well, if you purchased from Ebay and used PayPal, file a complaint. In a few weeks you should get your money back through their Buyer's Assurance program.

Will Microsoft reimburse me when I report it (and I will)?
I needed a good laugh this morning. Thanks.

Anybody else have these problems before? How did you fix? I've been tearing my hair out and I am very angry about the whole situation.
Consider it experience. We all make mistakes - the key is to learn from them. Always buy from legit sources. The only issue I've expereinced was purchasing XP Pro from Tiger Direct. Some of the license keys were already activated, but activating via telephone fixed that.

 

[Xander]

Originally Posted by Thedog
OR INSTALL a crack (wga-fix etc)? And also explain that the disadvantage with the crack is that their OS would stay illegal and Microsoft might release some update that makes it go back to not genuine?

Nope, never do this. Apart from the legality, it will go wrong at some stage in the future and it will be all the technicians fault!

Agreed. I'd never crack it but I might give them RemoveWGA with the explanation that their pirated Windows is still very much pirated but won't nag until the next time they let WGA back in.

Cracking Windows is just asking for trouble.

 

[4ycr]

I have found a guy in germany who sells legit XP OEM versions but I recently came across someone selling a fake Vista, his price was not that far below the normal price. I got my money back after I made a paypal claim.

On another note I have been asked to fix a couple of computers for someone and their local repair shop has put pirate copies of office on their computer. So I think open office will be getting downloaded as they do not want to buy MS office

 

[gunslinger]

Anyone have a Ubuntu disc? Problem solved. (unless they have have to run lots of proprietary Microsoft software)

 

[Xander]

Rrrriiiight. That's a great fix.

"Sorry, folks. Yeah, you can kind of run some of your software in Wine... what? Oh that's ... well, never mind. Oh, the kids' games? They're a complete write-off. Your custom VPN software from your employer? Yeah, you'll have to take that back to the IT Dept there and see if they'll approve... they won't, eh? Sucks to be you ... now."

 

[14049752]

Ubuntu is far better fix than cracking the software, or providing the customer the crack to do it themselves. Why? Because it's legal.

Techs cracking windows or providing the crack are no better than the original tech that installed the software. You're just continuing to allow it.

It REALLY sucks when those of us who are legitimate businesses that play by the rules have to explain why we're not able to reinstall Windows or Office for customers when they have a pirated version. It makes it that much worse when they've had a tech in the past that would make their pirated stuff work.


I'd be far happier seeing those techs explaining "Your copy of Windows is an illegal copy. Unfortunately, for me to get your computer to work, we'd have to do one of two things: 1. Purchase a copy of windows at the best cost I can find. or 2. Install free software alternatives." And if you explain the benefits and drawbacks of both cases, the customer is usually intelligent enough to make their own decision.

 

[RegEdit]

Pirates Suck

Do a search for "buy cheap software" and it's mostly sites hosted in Russia that sell pirated downloadable software like this one... http://cheapoemsoft.com/

 

[Cybjun]

just buy windows 7 professional or vista business (32-bit versions) OEM and use the downgrade rights. That is the official solution straight from microsoft corporate mouth. With those versions you can install your xp pro disc and key call then you will call and activate. Its a perfectly legal fix, it helps save your clients from buying a new computer however I wouldn't be above recommending a new computer over doing this, 150-200 for windows plus however much you charge for an OS install on a 4+ year old machine usually not worth it.

 

[gunslinger]

Ubuntu is far better fix than cracking the software, or providing the customer the crack to do it themselves. Why? Because it's legal.

Exactly. I'm not even a Linux fan but its as fast as Windows XP on older systems and when set up correctly will do about 95% of what a Windows box will do.


If I read the OP post right these computers are for a church? If thats the case I don't think they are gonna be running many high end games or custom VPN software. Most likely they just need to get online and do basic word processing.

 

[vdub12]

Why didnt you just tell the client that they had pirated versions and the only way to fix it was either to get Windows 7 OR INSTALL a crack (wga-fix etc)? And also explain that the disadvantage with the crack is that their OS would stay illegal and Microsoft might release some update that makes it go back to not genuine?

That's why you tell the client that it might only be a temporary solution. And Im not sure about what stage in the future. Both me and friends have used such cracks which have been working for years...

Ok I really hope your joking. That makes you part of the problem.

I have in the past fixed computers that had pirated copy's of windows on them but I will not make them "fake" genuine. If the customer has a virus or a problem unrelated to the pirated software I will fix it but if the problem is related to the pirated software theres nothing I can do but make it genuine. The problem is there next call is to a pizza tech that will fix it for half the price and make me look like a jack ass. Above poster is a good example.

just buy windows 7 professional or vista business (32-bit versions) OEM and use the downgrade rights. That is the official solution straight from microsoft corporate mouth. With those versions you can install your xp pro disc and key call then you will call and activate. Its a perfectly legal fix, it helps save your clients from buying a new computer however I wouldn't be above recommending a new computer over doing this, 150-200 for windows plus however much you charge for an OS install on a 4+ year old machine usually not worth it.

This is actually a good solution.

I just got off the phone with MS and the downgrade rights are only valid with windows 7 pro and ultimate and they are only valid for OEM copy's. Windows 7 pro is only $139 at newegg and this might be a doable alternative for customers wanting to continue using there older computers.

 

[Cybjun]

This is actually a good solution.

I just got off the phone with MS and the downgrade rights are only valid with windows 7 pro and ultimate and they are only valid for OEM copy's. Windows 7 pro is only $139 at newegg and this might be a doable alternative for customers wanting to continue using there older computers.

I know linux can get the PC up to a legal working state but my goal has always been to get the computer working as close to how it originally was but legally and malware & virus free.

 

[Blues]

How did it take until page 2 for someone to bring up Downgrade Rights? It was my first solution just get legit with Windows 7 Pro and use the downgrade rights to run Windows XP Pro. My after thought was is there no COA on these computer cases giving you a valid legit code to use with the proper version of Windows?

 

[vdub12]

How did it take until page 2 for someone to bring up Downgrade Rights? It was my first solution just get legit with Windows 7 Pro and use the downgrade rights to run Windows XP Pro. My after thought was is there no COA on these computer cases giving you a valid legit code to use with the proper version of Windows?

Manny of these computers are customs built by the customer or someone else and never had a valid copy of windows on them. The computers them selfs are fine and could last many years. However, without a valid copy of windows they will never be genuine.

I am on the phone with MS right now, they say you need a genuine copy of xp in order to down grade to xp. I don't think this guy has any clue what I am talking about.

Does anyone have a number of someone I can call at MS that knows what the he!! they are talking about.