Clients google business listing listed as 'Permenantly Closed'

[thecomputerguy]

Client called me because her business is marked as permanently closed which it is not, and now is not the time to be losing out on business.

The business is obviously already claimed because claiming it isn't an option when you search it on Google.

She and I have both reported it as Open, who knows how long that takes especially these days.

I sent her over here: https://support.google.com/business...l&rd=2&visit_id=637214520458094102-1850866528

To email Google business directly to see if that helps.

I asked her and of course she said, yeah we never claimed the business, so of course even if she did she has no idea what email she used to claim it or when, it could have been a decade ago for all we know.

And of course passwords ... right ...... . ...

Any options anyone else can think of?

 

[Moltuae]

This any help?
https://agentbrandingsystem.com/insurance-agent-marketing/recover_hijacked_google_my_business/

https://support.google.com/business/answer/4566671

 

[britechguy]

No. Google is definitely not one of the most "user friendly" entities when it comes to reporting issues of any kind.

And I am almost at wits end after working with a client of long standing who, as is typical, had no idea what her passwords were for multiple accounts, and when we needed to make specific changes had to go through the "forgot password" for them. And this is even though she is of the "paper and pencil" recording in a notebook set - she hadn't kept them up to date.

People need to clue in that passwords are important. It's also helpful (and I try to encourage it) to NOT use automatic password entry options where available, so that you become habituated to entering a password and, as a result, of remembering it because you have needed to enter it.

I should note that I have had reasonable luck getting responses from Google Business using their suggested contact methods. If your client does claim her business and get its status changed, emphasize two things to her:

1) She must do whatever she needs to do to keep track of her password.

2) She should not ignore messages from Google Business saying that a given piece of business information needs to be updated, even if that update is confirming it remains unchanged. Going in and making the updates when notified is the primary way your business remains considered to be still in business by Google Business. Which, to me, makes sense. If you ignore something long enough it's reasonable to believe it no longer exists, and "long enough" is a very long time in the case of Google Business.

 

[thecomputerguy]

This any help?
https://agentbrandingsystem.com/insurance-agent-marketing/recover_hijacked_google_my_business/

https://support.google.com/business/answer/4566671

I'll forward these along ... thank you

 

[thecomputerguy]

No. Google is definitely not one of the most "user friendly" entities when it comes to reporting issues of any kind.

And I am almost at wits end after working with a client of long standing who, as is typical, had no idea what her passwords were for multiple accounts, and when we needed to make specific changes had to go through the "forgot password" for them. And this is even though she is of the "paper and pencil" recording in a notebook set - she hadn't kept them up to date.

People need to clue in that passwords are important. It's also helpful (and I try to encourage it) to NOT use automatic password entry options where available, so that you become habituated to entering a password and, as a result, of remembering it because you have needed to enter it.

I should note that I have had reasonable luck getting responses from Google Business using their suggested contact methods. If your client does claim her business and get its status changed, emphasize two things to her:

1) She must do whatever she needs to do to keep track of her password.

2) She should not ignore messages from Google Business saying that a given piece of business information needs to be updated, even if that update is confirming it remains unchanged. Going in and making the updates when notified is the primary way your business remains considered to be still in business by Google Business. Which, to me, makes sense. If you ignore something long enough it's reasonable to believe it no longer exists, and "long enough" is a very long time in the case of Google Business.

Yeah same experience, I've had clients with bad reviews take weeks to get them removed.

As far as passwords go, that's a battle that simply can't be won by most clients. I have clients calling me all the time asking for THEIR iCloud password ... like WTF? Then when I ask clients for a password like their email password to setup the account in Outlook they say, "Oh I thought you had that." Why the F would I have YOUR password? As a matter of fact why don't you know YOUR password? Even if we made the password together it's YOUR password that YOU gave me, that I always specifically say, "Make sure you make a note of this!" when we made the account.... "Well I have no idea what it is".

I recently had a client who fired their Office manager for the second time in 6 months. When she gets an office manager she hands over EVERYTHING to this person. Then she fires them, they sabotage her and she calls me begging for help to find some way to change all her passwords all over again. Well ma'am I can reset all of your email passwords but that's all I have access to. "What about my amazon account? My banking account? My this account, my that account?" Sorry, not my problem, good luck.

I sat down with this lady and walked her through resetting as many passwords as I could or as she could think of, mid-way through I say, "Hey I just want to make sure, you are making note of all these passwords right?" because of course almost all of them were different. She responds with, "Uhhh yeah" after a long pause.

The next day I get a call from her saying hey so and so password is not working what did you reset it to? Excuse me? They are YOUR passwords, I told you to make note of them in some way shape or form, you did that right? "Well yeah I thought it was (most generic password)?" Ok well that doesn't ring a bell to me based on what we did yesterday, so it sounds like you didn't make notes during 2 hours of password changing? Okie dokie, lets do it all over again.

 

[britechguy]

I am genuinely convinced that a huge part of the issue with passwords would go away if people actually had to enter them. But they don't, and it's because someone had the bright idea that having things like web browsers, e-mail clients, etc., remember your passwords for you was a good idea. I would never consider handing over the keys to my home to any random third party I don't trust, but that's exactly what people do with passwords, whether to technology or, like that foolish office manager, to another person they barely know.

I have managed to get certain clients to accept my recommendation to use what I call The Portmanteau Method of Creating Passwords.
It makes it very easy for the person who should be able to remember them to do so, or at least make a couple of sequential very educated guesses, but well-nigh impossible for any random party to crack them. I personally think the very idea of creating random number-character sequences that no human being can remember, as is done by most password manager password generators, is insane. You need to be able to have a decent chance of being able to reconstruct your own password, via a formula known only to you, on many occasions when you're away from whatever method you use to store your passwords.

I also think it's a lot more important for a password's "human owner" to be able to retrieve it from their mind on demand than it is to go for absolute maximum security. Most of us are not the targets for nefarious actors since there's no real payoff. Most individuals' accounts for things like e-mail have zero utility to someone looking to make big bucks, fast. I would far rather that someone use a single password across a wide number of accounts provided it is long, say 15 characters, and is of a format of a portmanteau that no one other than the owner could possibly guess. If there's a data breach, you then go through all your accounts and change your password (which you should do on occasion, anyway).

 

[thecomputerguy]

I am genuinely convinced that a huge part of the issue with passwords would go away if people actually had to enter them. But they don't, and it's because someone had the bright idea that having things like web browsers, e-mail clients, etc., remember your passwords for you was a good idea. I would never consider handing over the keys to my home to any random third party I don't trust, but that's exactly what people do with passwords, whether to technology or, like that foolish office manager, to another person they barely know.

I have managed to get certain clients to accept my recommendation to use what I call The Portmanteau Method of Creating Passwords.
It makes it very easy for the person who should be able to remember them to do so, or at least make a couple of sequential very educated guesses, but well-nigh impossible for any random party to crack them. I personally think the very idea of creating random number-character sequences that no human being can remember, as is done by most password manager password generators, is insane. You need to be able to have a decent chance of being able to reconstruct your own password, via a formula known only to you, on many occasions when you're away from whatever method you use to store your passwords.

I also think it's a lot more important for a password's "human owner" to be able to retrieve it from their mind on demand than it is to go for absolute maximum security. Most of us are not the targets for nefarious actors since there's no real payoff. Most individuals' accounts for things like e-mail have zero utility to someone looking to make big bucks, fast. I would far rather that someone use a single password across a wide number of accounts provided it is long, say 15 characters, and is of a format of a portmanteau that no one other than the owner could possibly guess. If there's a data breach, you then go through all your accounts and change your password (which you should do on occasion, anyway).

I personally think that passwords are so incredibly primitive in terms of security and the only way to move forward with authentication is bio metrics across the board. Of course that would take years or decades to implement and at the end of the day it would more than likely give more power to our government overlords. With everything going on right now with this coronavirus and all the uncertainty god knows we do not want to do that.

I think passwords give a degree of anonymity (OR a perception of anonymity) even still no matter how complex they are because if something is done under your user, you can always go back and say you were hacked, or it wasn't you, or someone else had your password, and that gives the perception of comfort and security. If you don't think the government can get your passwords you are mistaken. Of course everything can be traced back to IP's and MACs but that's beyond the point.

Is bio capable of being manipulated? I'm sure of it, but I only see bio as being the future of personal security, or for that matter personal insecurity.

I also believe that global unification is the only way this planet won't kill itself, which is a good thing! and a terrible thing.

/tinfoilhat disable

 

[Computer Bloke]

the only way to move forward with authentication is bio metrics across the board.

Without passwords we'd need some way for our clients to deposit a finger or eyeball with us for remote access. I can't see that going down well.

 

[carmen617]

I am genuinely convinced that a huge part of the issue with passwords would go away if people actually had to enter them. But they don't, and it's because someone had the bright idea that having things like web browsers, e-mail clients, etc., remember your passwords for you was a good idea. I would never consider handing over the keys to my home to any random third party I don't trust, but that's exactly what people do with passwords, whether to technology or, like that foolish office manager, to another person they barely know.

I have managed to get certain clients to accept my recommendation to use what I call The Portmanteau Method of Creating Passwords.
It makes it very easy for the person who should be able to remember them to do so, or at least make a couple of sequential very educated guesses, but well-nigh impossible for any random party to crack them. I personally think the very idea of creating random number-character sequences that no human being can remember, as is done by most password manager password generators, is insane. You need to be able to have a decent chance of being able to reconstruct your own password, via a formula known only to you, on many occasions when you're away from whatever method you use to store your passwords.

I also think it's a lot more important for a password's "human owner" to be able to retrieve it from their mind on demand than it is to go for absolute maximum security. Most of us are not the targets for nefarious actors since there's no real payoff. Most individuals' accounts for things like e-mail have zero utility to someone looking to make big bucks, fast. I would far rather that someone use a single password across a wide number of accounts provided it is long, say 15 characters, and is of a format of a portmanteau that no one other than the owner could possibly guess. If there's a data breach, you then go through all your accounts and change your password (which you should do on occasion, anyway).

I didn't know that is what it was called, but that's the process I always tell my clients to follow. They are always so grateful, when I tell them they can't keep using their pet Skippy's name, but they can use Skippy123$BofA$ for Bank of America and Skippy123@Gmail@ for their email account and be reasonably safe.

 

[thecomputerguy]

Without passwords we'd need some way for our clients to deposit a finger or eyeball with us for remote access. I can't see that going down well.

It may be less painful than trying to get an actual working password out of clients... at least for me jus sayin

Hey if I need to reboot your computer whats your password for when it first boots up? Oh its skippy123.

Hey client that password didn't work? Whats your login password? It's skippy123! No it's not I just tried it. Hang on ... No it is skippy123! No I mean when your computer first turns on I need that password. Oh I thought you wanted my iCloud password! No I want your computer password when it first boots up ... oh then why didnt you ask? It's skippy1234! No sir that doesn't work either. What do you mean? Thats my password! skippy1234 doesn't work I need your computer password. Oh that's right I'm sorry thats the same as my bank of america password it's password2 you know I always use password1 but they made me change it to password2 so my banking password has to match my aol password so password2. No sir password2 didn't work, WHAT is the password you use when the computer first boots up after you've had your coffee in morning when you press the button on your computer and it turns on and the lights come on?

Hold on I can't remember it off the top of my head I type it in everyday but I have to type it or else I can't remember it, one second please.

Ok it's skippy123

No sir I already tried that and it didn't work

OK try 1

1 is your password?

Yes I set it up as 1 so I wouldn't forget it.

So just ... the numeral .. 1 ?

Yes

Ok thanks I got in.

Later that evening: Hey as soon as you fixed my outlook my iPad wont facetime, what did you do?

 

[Sky-Knight]

Biometrics will never replace passwords. All the bioreader does, regardless of what its reading is use that reading to create a token, the token becomes the new password. Once that password is broken, because it was saved somewhere... and easily lifted just like any other saved password... how do you change it? The reader only reads it one way!

The token has to be salted with a password or a pin so it can be changed, that's why you see biometrics in use as a 2nd factor, and never as a primary authentication mechanism.

Authentication is hard.

@carmen617's process is a good one, pass phrases beat passwords any day. I actually recommend password managers exclusively now. Two keys to get in, vault of generated stuff no one has to think about... pure gold.

 

[thecomputerguy]

Biometrics will never replace passwords. All the bioreader does, regardless of what its reading is use that reading to create a token, the token becomes the new password. Once that password is broken, because it was saved somewhere... and easily lifted just like any other saved password... how do you change it? The reader only reads it one way!

The token has to be salted with a password or a pin so it can be changed, that's why you see biometrics in use as a 2nd factor, and never as a primary authentication mechanism.

Authentication is hard.

@carmen617's process is a good one, pass phrases beat passwords any day. I actually recommend password managers exclusively now. Two keys to get in, vault of generated stuff no one has to think about... pure gold.

Simple, a global (or national) bio-metric system that resets your token on use possibly coupled with iris recognition or a globally accepted PIN which then becomes a nationally currency agent eliminating the use for credit cards or other forms of identification.

Can those be cracked? Sure they can, everything can, just like I said before if you don't want your passwords given to a higher power then live in the backwoods.

Passwords just like credit cards (which are meant to be held on persons) can track what you buy and where you buy it at what time. Credit cards are no different than a fingerprint for location, and while credit cards can get stolen the companies are always trying to change how they can be manipulated i.e. from swipe to now chip, and now with near range credit cards. Unusual purchases being backed by 2nd factor text message/phone authentication.

Regardless of whether it's you are not, if there is something that doesn't add up it even if it gets stolen you can always follow the breadcrumbs to how or how it doesn't make sense that it was you or it was not.

 

[britechguy]

Biometrics will never replace passwords.
.
.
.
@carmen617's process is a good one, pass phrases beat passwords any day. I actually recommend password managers exclusively now. Two keys to get in, vault of generated stuff no one has to think about... pure gold.

I absolutely agree that biometrics will never replace passwords if for no other reason that the idea creeps out too many people. It doesn't matter how good a given technology might be, or how much better it is, if you cannot get the masses comfortable with even the idea of using it. They're also way more than adequate for the vast majority of what they're intended to protect if they're even moderately decent passwords.

Also, look back at my post regarding the Portmanteau Method, and where it fell in the topic flow.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Credit cards are just a physical token, they are identical to biometrics except completely artificial. And they expire and get replaced for a whole host of reasons.

Proper API access only uses a Base64 string, there isn't even a login and a password it's just a silly long username that used once and stored in the specific system in question. If you think it's been stolen, you replace it, and systems operate on the Internet all day every day with such thing securing things and they work fine.

But your finger print, or your retinal scan will never be a good "password", it's a great second token, but you need an artificial one up front.

So for example going back to the CC example, backing up a CC with a finger print is actually a really good authentication mechanism. Nothing to remember, easy to use, and secure enough to protect a top secret lab. The problem? You can't give your finger print to your kid so they can use your card too. So now we need to authorize additional tokens to get into your stuff in advance, and we never seem to get ahead of that game.

Again, authentication is hard.

 

[Diggs]

I carry and freely give out password books to my more challenged customers.

 

[britechguy]

@Diggs,

Yep. As much as it's screamed by many that you should never write down your passwords, even worse is losing them to the mists of memory if you don't. Even if you're typing some of them in frequently, there will always be a collection of "seldom used" ones you'll forget (unless you use the previously noted Portmanteau Method of creating all your passwords).

And I'm always willing to presume that physical access to a password book or sheet is completely under the control of its owner and that it is actually controlled (even if that means tucking it in the corner of the closet where only you know it's there).

 

[carmen617]

@Diggs,

Yep. As much as it's screamed by many that you should never write down your passwords, even worse is losing them to the mists of memory if you don't. Even if you're typing some of them in frequently, there will always be a collection of "seldom used" ones you'll forget (unless you use the previously noted Portmanteau Method of creating all your passwords).

And I'm always willing to presume that physical access to a password book or sheet is completely under the control of its owner and that it is actually controlled (even if that means tucking it in the corner of the closet where only you know it's there).

I tell my little old ladies "if someone is breaking into your house to steal your password book, you have worse problems than that they can access your account"

I have one who keeps them all handwritten on a sheet of paper taped into an old seed catalog in a stack of old magazines. Pretty good solution, I'd say!

 

[roborobs computer repair]

I am genuinely convinced that a huge part of the issue with passwords would go away if people actually had to enter them. But they don't, and it's because someone had the bright idea that having things like web browsers, e-mail clients, etc., remember your passwords for you was a good idea. I would never consider handing over the keys to my home to any random third party I don't trust, but that's exactly what people do with passwords, whether to technology or, like that foolish office manager, to another person they barely know.

Only password management software I trust is LastPass. It is zero trust therefore they have no way of knowing my passwords and I have full control and can use much more complicated passwords than my brain can remember. Just don't let it automatically import from your browser. It can get screwed up very easily.

 

[Sky-Knight]

I'd rather have clients using a password book they know about and protect, than a ton of sticky notes all over everything. If that book goes missing we know we're in for trouble. So my older clients, I recommend books as well, in duplicate with one of them in the fireproof safe. They make a new password, they have to update both.

It works surprisingly well.

 

[roborobs computer repair]

I'd rather have clients using a password book they know about and protect, than a ton of sticky notes all over everything. If that book goes missing we know we're in for trouble. So my older clients, I recommend books as well, in duplicate with one of them in the fireproof safe. They make a new password, they have to update both.

It works surprisingly well.

To me this is like a backup that requires human intervention to complete. It's not a backup.

I can tell you for my wife she has an excel document on her PC that is encrypted and has all her passwords in it. This file is synced between our nas and my pc as a backup. Done automatically using free file sync.


With using a book someone could easily take a picture of the passwords and you'd never know.