Best Long Range Wi-Fi Network setup

[LordX]

I have a property that wants wi-fi to extend from a back lot, across the street to a home on the other side.

There is a good chance that running an Ethernet to the other side of the road will not work.

What would be an option?

If ethernet is able to be run, what would be the best way of extending the wi-fi signal on the other property? Can a mesh system have 3 'pods' in one home, then three in the other home? All running off of the one internet connection?

I have never ventured into wi-fi setups larger than home level, so I hate to admit it, but I am a noob when it comes to this level of wi-fi setup.

 

[Diggs]

Although you didn't say how far it was I'd probably use a pair of Ubiquity Lite Beams. You'd need to add an access point at the far end.

 

[nlinecomputers]

Ubnt nano stations or nano beams.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

So....you have 2x different approaches.
*Mesh...wireless repeaters. For WiFi all the way across. Comes with some performance loss per hop.
*You actually mention you envision running an ethernet cable across. So....you can do what is called "point to point" wireless. Such as Ubiquitis airMAX and airFIBER products. You get two radios, fiddle with some settings, point them at each other...and start walking far away from each other. A mile, two miles, 5 miles, 10 miles, yeah..more...up past 100. Depending on the model you choose. These radios basically create an invisible network cable. Each has an ethernet port...just pretend they're two switches with that invisible network cable in between.

Point to Point wireless is how we setup a lot of "campus area networks" now....when there is no underground conduit between the buildings. Dirt cheap, and reliable. And really no performance loss. I have a 150 meg connection going over 6 miles and there is barely a 2ms latency in that link...and a network of over 50 fairly heavy users on the other end.

I've had clients buy a building next door to their main office..and expand their offices into that second building...I just put a pair of these on the outside of the buildings facing each other..and BOOM...instantly building B's network is attached to building A's like I ran ethernet cable from rooftop to rooftop.

https://airmax.ui.com/

They have models ranging from very inexpensive..under 70 bucks each, to huge units over a thousand each.

https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205197750-airMAX-Which-product-should-I-use-

So...they don't do wifi...they just create that invisible ethernet cable connecting Building A to Building B. You'd still hang wireless access points behind it.

 

[glennd]

They have models ranging from very inexpensive..under 70 bucks each, to huge units over a thousand each.

https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205197750-airMAX-Which-product-should-I-use-

So...they don't do wifi...they just create that invisible ethernet cable connecting Building A to Building B. You'd still hang wireless access points behind it.

Sorry to jump in. The airmax link reminded me to ask. I've been idly discussing a big link with a customer for a while and the one question I want to know is just how line-of-sight it needs to be?

What do I mean by big link? In the order of 12-15km with town and hills in between. Is such a thing even remotely feasible?

 

[backwoodsman]

What do I mean by big link? In the order of 12-15km with town and hills in between. Is such a thing even remotely feasible?

Not a chance. You can get away with a few trees with cross-polarized antennas; or better yet, circular polarized, but those are hard to find. But you can't go through hills.

 

[glennd]

Not a chance. You can get away with a few trees with cross-polarized antennas; or better yet, circular polarized, but those are hard to find. But you can't go through hills.

I thought as much. Back to the scheduled program....

 

[SAFCasper]

Sorry to jump in. The airmax link reminded me to ask. I've been idly discussing a big link with a customer for a while and the one question I want to know is just how line-of-sight it needs to be?

What do I mean by big link? In the order of 12-15km with town and hills in between. Is such a thing even remotely feasible?

Ubiquiti have a link planner for this - https://link.ui.com/#

Stick Point A and Point B on the map and it will calculate the distances, elevations etc to give you an estimate of connection quality.

If there is a hill between your antenna the odds are it's not going to work, but worth checking. With distances as large as 15Km it's very hard to judge by eye... you might find the hill isn't actually in your way. Or it gets lucky and hits a lower point.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Sorry to jump in. The airmax link reminded me to ask. I've been idly discussing a big link with a customer for a while and the one question I want to know is just how line-of-sight it needs to be?

What do I mean by big link? In the order of 12-15km with town and hills in between. Is such a thing even remotely feasible?

Trees....yes you can go through some...varies based on the type of tree. And distance....how much "forest" you need to go through. Higher frequency radios such as 5.0....they'll tolerate some foliage. Less with coniferous trees (pine trees). And with foliage...after a good rain, performance can be less as leaves are filled with water. But they can go through several hundred feet of a few trees. The 2.4 radios..a bit more. And the 900 radios...even more. Obviously your goal is "line of site"..and do trimming of tree branches to clear a path...I've hired utility company bucket trucks and crew to take the top off of some mature maple trees to clear a good path for the fresnel zone. So...just be aware how much bandwidth you need on the other side, and you'll have some performance loss with foliage..and see if it works.

As for hills....no. Buildings...pretty much "no"...although you can get a 900 to punch some through a lightly constructed home.
HOWEVER...some "gotta do it" people have gotten creative in dealing with hills or big buildings. They'll do multiple hops to get around, or up/over. For example..put a pair up top a hill, one radio facing down one side, on radio facing down the other side. Connect the back ends. Now on the ground, you setup a radio facing up first side, and another on the back side. Now you've done a 4x hop setup to shoot up and over the hill. In cities, people have gotten creative to go around tall buildings in their way...just go around the sides with multiple hops.

 

[Your PCMD]

I have a property that wants wi-fi to extend from a back lot, across the street to a home on the other side.

You say "you" have a property, not that a client has a property, so I will give you advise as if it is you that owns it. If you don't, it will still apply, just replace yourself with "the clients".

I don't know where you reside, but if in the US, no one has mentioned the fact that sharing WiFi with a neighbor is not 'illegal' as such, however it would most likely be against the terms of service from your ISP, and therefore breaking the contract with the broadband supplier. If you're going to consider this, it would definitely be worth checking the Terms and Conditions of the provider before doing so.

You risk a heavy fine, or even the suspension of your internet line by your ISP. Also, how well do you trust the neighbor? Their kids if any? They could download something illegal, and it would look to law enforcement agencies as if you're the culprit. And since you'd be sharing your local network as well as your Internet connection, you'd be risking getting hacked, ransomware, etc.

And what happens if you go on vacation or aren't at home if the service goes down? The neighbor would lose connection because they will not be able to call up the ISP for issues.

I would find out firstly if you can do this. The ISP would almost certainly object. After all, they're losing money in this arrangement. If you read their Terms of Service, you're bound to find something banning such behavior.

However, if you are able to do it and the ISP clears such an arrangement, as mentioned above from others, use Ubiquiti and defiantly set up a separate wireless network and sub net for the neighbor to connect to to reduce "issues".

Just my 2 cents as I get asked to do this from time to time but decline to do so as I know the ISP's terms in my area. Which is a $5,000 fine and up to a year in prison if you're caught sharing services unless it's on the property at which the service is billed to. Internet is cheap (where I am) at just $50/mo for 100 meg service, so to me there's no reason to share internet.

 

[glennd]

Ubiquiti have a link planner for this - https://link.ui.com/#

Stick Point A and Point B on the map and it will calculate the distances, elevations etc to give you an estimate of connection quality.

If there is a hill between your antenna the odds are it's not going to work, but worth checking. With distances as large as 15Km it's very hard to judge by eye... you might find the hill isn't actually in your way. Or it gets lucky and hits a lower point.

I didn't know about the planner. That's gonna be a big help for a couple of projects. Thanks.

 

[glennd]

As for hills....no. Buildings...pretty much "no"...although you can get a 900 to punch some through a lightly constructed home.
HOWEVER...some "gotta do it" people have gotten creative in dealing with hills or big buildings. They'll do multiple hops to get around, or up/over. For example..put a pair up top a hill, one radio facing down one side, on radio facing down the other side. Connect the back ends. Now on the ground, you setup a radio facing up first side, and another on the back side. Now you've done a 4x hop setup to shoot up and over the hill. In cities, people have gotten creative to go around tall buildings in their way...just go around the sides with multiple hops.

Multiple hops would be required to get around or over the hills. Probably outside of the scope...

 

[glennd]

You're thinking too small - just spread a rumour that there's silver in the hills and wait.

It worked in Broken Hill, it can work for you too.

The only thing in them thar hills is sheep dung.

 

[LordX]

So....you have 2x different approaches.
*Mesh...wireless repeaters. For WiFi all the way across. Comes with some performance loss per hop.
*You actually mention you envision running an ethernet cable across. So....you can do what is called "point to point" wireless. Such as Ubiquitis airMAX and airFIBER products. You get two radios, fiddle with some settings, point them at each other...and start walking far away from each other. A mile, two miles, 5 miles, 10 miles, yeah..more...up past 100. Depending on the model you choose. These radios basically create an invisible network cable. Each has an ethernet port...just pretend they're two switches with that invisible network cable in between.

Point to Point wireless is how we setup a lot of "campus area networks" now....when there is no underground conduit between the buildings. Dirt cheap, and reliable. And really no performance loss. I have a 150 meg connection going over 6 miles and there is barely a 2ms latency in that link...and a network of over 50 fairly heavy users on the other end.

I've had clients buy a building next door to their main office..and expand their offices into that second building...I just put a pair of these on the outside of the buildings facing each other..and BOOM...instantly building B's network is attached to building A's like I ran ethernet cable from rooftop to rooftop.

https://airmax.ui.com/

They have models ranging from very inexpensive..under 70 bucks each, to huge units over a thousand each.

https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205197750-airMAX-Which-product-should-I-use-

So...they don't do wifi...they just create that invisible ethernet cable connecting Building A to Building B. You'd still hang wireless access points behind it.

Sorry for the huge delay - I am finally getting ready to dive into this. I am just going across the street from one home to the next. Both are owned by me. I looked at the link you posted, but cant seem to find the exact product you mention. One shows as connecting to a hardwire, but then broadcasting wi-fi. Def dont want to buy the wrong thing as I will be having an electrician hard wire this into the new construction.

 

[SAFCasper]

Didn't mention an exact model as far as I can see. Just referenced the AirMax an AirFibre ranges which covers maybe 30+ different models.

Would need to know the rough distance between the two properties and what speeds you require before we can make a good recommendation.

 

[LordX]

Didn't mention an exact model as far as I can see. Just referenced the AirMax an AirFibre ranges which covers maybe 30+ different models.

Would need to know the rough distance between the two properties and what speeds you require before we can make a good recommendation.

Oh, right across the street - couldn't be more than 200 feet.

I think the best speed I can get out here is 20 megabit.

 

[Mick]

Just my 2 cents as I get asked to do this from time to time but decline to do so as I know the ISP's terms in my area. Which is a $5,000 fine and up to a year in prison if you're caught sharing services

You can go to prison for a civil offence in the States?

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Sorry for the huge delay - I am finally getting ready to dive into this. I am just going across the street from one home to the next. Both are owned by me. I looked at the link you posted, but cant seem to find the exact product you mention. One shows as connecting to a hardwire, but then broadcasting wi-fi. Def dont want to buy the wrong thing as I will be having an electrician hard wire this into the new construction.

Sounds like you just want to connect 2x buildings with a "point to point" link. So you'd used an airMax, or an airFiber (bigger, most carrier grade), or..that new Unifi building to building "bridge" (which comes already paired...you get 2x radios in the kit. With the airMax and airFiber units...you purchase individually and then pair them yourself. (or some resellers pre-pair a set for you before shipping).

https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205197750-airMAX-Which-product-should-I-use-

What speed link do you want between the buildings?
Pure clear clean line of site? Or anything in between?
What is the distance?

 

[Your PCMD]

You can go to prison for a civil offence in the States?

You can go to prison for simply sneezing now-a-days in the states it seems.

 

[LordX]

Sounds like you just want to connect 2x buildings with a "point to point" link. So you'd used an airMax, or an airFiber (bigger, most carrier grade), or..that new Unifi building to building "bridge" (which comes already paired...you get 2x radios in the kit. With the airMax and airFiber units...you purchase individually and then pair them yourself. (or some resellers pre-pair a set for you before shipping).

https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/205197750-airMAX-Which-product-should-I-use-

What speed link do you want between the buildings?
Pure clear clean line of site? Or anything in between?
What is the distance?

The best internet available up here is around 20 to 30 Mbit. So a 100Mbit connection would be sufficient.

Some brush in between, but no huge trees or other buildings (or hills).

Distance is maybe 200 feet.