Bernie Sanders is only candidate that opposes CISA

As I said, my family voted democrat for a while, I did. I even voted for Kerry in 04. But when the current administration got in, I think they were too liberal for us, and our family started voting republican. I don't think dad was a big Reagan fan. Dad always said it seemed like when a republican was in it seemed like they did worse financially than when a democrat was in.
 
Oh it soared, all right. For the rich.

.

It soared for everyone.
The economy launched into the stratosphere! He brought in the second longest peacetime economic expansion in US history!
Lower taxes across the board. Yes...national debt came...since he slashed the governments income by lowering taxes across the board, and his big spending in expanding the military. But the lowered taxes and big push in military production had a long term positive effect of ..that huge economic expansion mentioned above. Small, medium, and large businesses grew and grew. Income across families grew. And the country felt great about itself, we had patriotism, people that felt good about the country, and felt good about life. People had pride! There were all raised to levels the country has never maintained levels of since then.
 
It soared for everyone.
The economy launched into the stratosphere! He brought in the second longest peacetime economic expansion in US history!
Lower taxes across the board. Yes...national debt came...since he slashed the governments income by lowering taxes across the board, and his big spending in expanding the military. But the lowered taxes and big push in military production had a long term positive effect of ..that huge economic expansion mentioned above. Small, medium, and large businesses grew and grew. Income across families grew. And the country felt great about itself, we had patriotism, people that felt good about the country, and felt good about life. People had pride! There were all raised to levels the country has never maintained levels of since then.


Facts seem to be a little different...

http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/08/news/economy/reagan_years_taxes/

All told, the tax increases Reagan approved ended up canceling out much of the reduction in tax revenue that resulted from his 1981 legislation.

Annual federal tax receipts during his presidency averaged 18.2% of GDP, a smidge below the average under President Carter -- and a smidge above the 40-year average today.

Rick
 

I recall it being about 30-50% of the tax cuts, were brought back towards the end of his year. Not the "cancelling out MUCH" as the above site claims. But we can go search for biased results all day and all night..and cut and paste from our favorite biased site to try to back things up.

There's more to tax receipt percentage of the GDP that allows it to be thrown inaccurately around on a bias. It's not just from individual and business taxes....which if you look at those directly, well..the pure explosion of growth the economy can testify to that.

People also conveniently forget to include the military growth..in the numbers that try to claim Reagan grew the gov't instead of making it smaller. Gov't employee list went up, but government outside of the military didn't grow like they try to claim it did by including the mililtary growth.

Anyways, bowing out. Not many here old enough to remember those years accurately. And going back to my main point....patriotism and the good proud old fashioned values that soared in America during the 80's..and flowing into the 90's.
 
People also conveniently forget to include the military growth..in the numbers that try to claim Reagan grew the gov't instead of making it smaller. Gov't employee list went up, but government outside of the military didn't grow like they try to claim it did by including the mililtary growth.

Actually it did. Uniformed military personnel only accounted for 26 percent of the increase. That is a fact. The idea that he did anything else is Fox News mythology.

....patriotism and the good proud old fashioned values that soared in America during the 80's..and flowing into the 90's.

Those values were mostly greed and stomping on the little guy. And hey, Germans felt pretty good about Germany in the 1930s. I'm not a fan of patriotism for patriotism's sake.
 
People also conveniently forget to include the military growth..in the numbers that try to claim Reagan grew the gov't instead of making it smaller. Gov't employee list went up, but government outside of the military didn't grow like they try to claim it did by including the mililtary growth.

Not to mention the Military is perhaps the largest socialist welfare program of them all.
 
Hey!!! Let's not forget to include some conversation on Religion & Sex!
Sure, Bernie Sanders and virtually all of the democrats want to get government out of your bedroom and out of religion... yet, the ones who complain about the government's overreach want to tell you who you can have sex with and how... and they also want to make everyone believe that this is a "Christian Nation" and ban Muslims even though the Constitution is crystal clear on that subject.
 
Those values were mostly greed and stomping on the little guy. And hey, Germans felt pretty good about Germany in the 1930s. I'm not a fan of patriotism for patriotism's sake.

Sorry I'm not a Fox news fan...or in fact a fan of any media.

As for the Germans...do a bit of digging, and you'll find that the average citizen in Germany, even during the early years of pre-WWII and the rise of Hitler ...they were in fear. Those black 'n white news reels you see of crowds cheering...they weren't really representative of the spirit of the citizens. They lived in fear, they feared not appearing supportive to the gray long coats. The Nazi's exterminated over 20 million of its own citizens...I'm not talking about his war on race, and the Jewish, I'm talking German citizens. This caused fear...not patriotism..they put that fake face on for survival purposes.
 
Neither Techlady nor YeOldeStonecat are wrong, but neither fully correct, either. The situation in Nazi Germany was quite a bit more complex than you have laid out (Or that is even reasonable to discuss here at length due to the breadth of the subject). From 1930 to 1933, Techlady is exactly right... Germany was a Democratic country and Hindenburgh was elected President of Germany by the Socialist parties (And splinter parties such as the Socialist workers party). These parties didn't elect "Hitler" or the ideas of Nazi Germany, rather, they elected Hindenburg who went full retard by first starting the Reichstag Fire and then issuing the Reichstag Fire Decree which basically nullified all civil liberties in the country (On a separate note, this is where the Republican party has so many parallels with Nazi Germany's Reichstag and America's 9/11... 9/11 we trampled our civil liberties in the name of "Security", just like the Germans did).
This isn't what the populous voted for nor what President Hindenburg ran his race on... basically did a 180, if you can call it that. This is where modern talking points and Republicans get it wrong... it wasn't the doing of Socialists or Democrats or their values or ideas that caused Nazi Germany. It was the fact that Hindenburg and Hitler were maniacs (Or however you want to correctly classify it). Hitler was appointed chancellor in 1933 and Hindenburg died in 1934 at which point immediately prior he (Hindenburg) abolished the "Presidential" position and replaced it with the new position of Fuhrer, in which Hitler succeeded. From 1934 and on, it's mostly history from here and this is where Stonecat is right.. the populace lived mostly in fear.. but it is more complicated than that and there are too many dynamics at play. Nazi Germany certainly had a majority of Hitler supporters by 1938 that were NOT living in fear. Why? Because all of the dissenters had been hauled away to jail or executed. Now you may say, "Well, obviously those people were living in fear", well, according to history the propaganda of the day worked and the populace was scared of the minorities such as the Jews and Poles. Most of the people hauled away by the SA and SS were reported by their own neighbors (and usually, not always, correctly so!). The people literally feared the Jews, not Hitler. Hitler knew that he couldn't be the focus of the fear, rather, he needed the "fear" focused on his dissenters and "enemies". The people went along with that.

So, let us not follow down that path. There is a party that fears "groups" in America right now and we are giving up our liberties/freedom for security... give you one guess as to which party.

I would also suggest the book "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" by William Shirer who was IN Nazi Germany before and after everything went down. The parallels between the current US Republican party (Mainly Bush Jr.) and the Third Reich are uncanny to say the least. I'm not going to argue this point because I own and read the book which is still considered the definitive authority of Hitlers German Empire.

We are used to 'not living in fear' in the nation. When it comes to having to defend ourselves on our own soil, you're going to wish you had someone in the White House who has a set of balls.
Nobody should ever live in fear. Fear produces irrationality. Fear and Irrationality is exactly how Nazi Germany started and is literally the absolute worst response. As far as needing a President with Balls.. just about the most ridiculous thing I have heard. In the event that the US is attacked on its soil there are plans and procedures that are followed irrespective of the President. This is carried out by USNORTHCOM under the Unified Command Plan and Air Forces Northern National Security Preparedness Directorate and THAT will take control of the situation. 4-star generals and Admirals known as Combatant Commanders would exercise command authority over their assigned forces. While the President can certainly make judgement calls.. the system is setup as such that the President doesn't even need to be in the picture. I think rather you are referring to attacks or operations outside of US soil which does (in theory) require the President and Congress to sign off on it... although, Bush went to war without Congress's approval.. so yet more trampling of the law by Republicans (and more direct parallels with Nazi Germany!). http://www.mediamonitors.net/francis21.html
 
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Nobody should ever live in fear. Fear produces irrationality. Fear and Irrationality is exactly how Nazi Germany started and is literally the absolute worst response. As far as needing a President with Balls.. just about the most ridiculous thing I have heard. In the event that the US is attacked on it's soil there are plans and procedures that are followed irrespective of the President.
And I am speaking of the influx of people now into this country who specifically say that they want to destroy us, that their mandate is to kill us (unless we're of their faith). We need strong boarders and a policy that will be followed throughout the States to remove illegals committing crimes.
I've traveled in Europe, you better have a passport and if you plan to sleep in a bed other than your own, you will surrender your passport. As an American, try to own land in 'some' other countries. There are many that won't let you. Pop on down to Mexico, they want you there but if you run out of money, they send you packing.
And I am all for the right to bare arms... though I don't currently own one but having grown up with them and having served in the armed forces, I know how to use one. I fortunately live in an area where at present I don't feel the need to have one, though I wouldn't say that there isn't one in the house.
 
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And I am speaking of the influx of people now into this country who specifically say that they want to destroy us, that their mandate is to kill us (unless we're of their faith). We need strong boarders and a policy that will be followed throughout the States to remove illegals committing crimes.

Simply because you say so doesn't make it true. Last time I looked, far-Right extremists have performed almost twice as many attacks on the US than Jihadists since 9/11.. so where's your concern for homegrown terrorism and why isn't that issue #1? Homegrown terrorism since 9/11 is responsible for almost double the amount of deaths as well.

Who do you believe is influxing into the US with a mandate to destroy us unless we are of faith? First show me the proof of influx then you can explain the idea of their mandate... would be news to me.

If you are referring to Islamic extremists:
We know the Quran orders believers to fight in combat against those who are the oppressors, aggressors and terrorists and those who are assaulting and killing the innocent men, women and children. But it gives out clear orders - NOT TO Fight against those who are not fighting against you...
http://www.justaskislam.com/32/does-islam-say-kill-the-infidels/

Seeing as we had a quasi-illegal wars with 2 countries that had virtually nothing to do with 9/11 - would you not see that as US oppression from their POV?

Christianity isn't any better than Islam when you consider violence and retribution (as per the Quran and Bible) and Christian extremists hold the record for most terrorist attacks in recent history.. so don't give me the "Holier than thou" thing. Look unto ourselves to make the most change for better.

The problem isn't Islam, the problem is Religious extremists - from any religion. Want to stop the Middle East from getting up in arms? Stop being the aggressors and intervening in everyone's affairs.

Here's some facts about illegal immigration and the "influx" that isn't happening, in fact, immigration numbers have stabilized for virtually a decade. How inconvenient.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/07/24/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/

Not to mention:
MYTH: Weak border enforcement has led to high rates of undocumented immigration. We should increase enforcement and build a wall around our border.
FACT: Increased border security and the construction of border fences have done little to curb the flow of immigrants across the United States border. Instead, these policies have only succeeded in pushing border crossers into dangerous and less-patrolled regions, and increased the undocumented population by creating an incentive for immigrants not to leave.
https://www.aclu.org/immigration-myths-and-facts

More:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/20/us/politics/facing-the-facts-on-illegal-immigration.html

On Immigrant Crime and Tom Tancredo of Florida (Of who the Republicans keep basing their talking points):
http://www.politifact.com/punditfac...ancredo-muffs-illegal-immigrant-murder-stats/
http://www.psmag.com/politics-and-law/illegal-immigration-might-actually-reduce-crime-rates

Most of the crime rates are skewed because the Republican talking heads and pundits are including the act of "border crossing" as a crime.. while it very well may be, it's not a violent crime such as murder or rape, etc.

Don't take my word for it, here's the darned report from the GAO:
http://www.gao.gov/assets/320/316959.pdf

  • An estimated 25,000 of these undocumented immigrants serving sentences for homicide
  • A cumulative total of 2.89 million offenses committed by these undocumented immigrants between 2003 and 2009 (although half a million of these were for immigration-related offenses)
  • Among those offenses: An estimated 42,000 robberies, 70,000 sex crimes, 81,000 auto thefts, 95,000 weapons offenses, and 213,000 assaults
That's over a 7-year period! Now go look at:
FBI 2014 Crime in the United States and you can reconcile the numbers for yourself. I came up with 5-7% myself depending on what you decide to include. What do you come up with?

Why does the FBI summary on violent crime conclude that violent crime has decreased 1% from 2013 to 2014 and 16.2% below the 2005 level? Here ya go.

EDIT: Also, if you want to find out WHY people are coming from Mexico and other parts of South America it's largely because of the US's drug policies and "The War on Drugs" that enables the cartels which do the killing, which causes the population to flee. But pay no attention to the cause of immigration or try to help our neighbors (Which in turn, would help our problems). The drug war has failed.

Stop being placated to; stop taking the silver spoon of BS and do some of your own homework, or don't. Regardless, the facts are there irrespective of your thoughts.
 
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"... it wasn't the doing of Socialists or Democrats or their values or ideas that caused Nazi Germany."

I think we have to go back one step further, back to the insanity of Weimar and the collapse of the currency. The paipermark was replaced by the Rentenmark, then the Reichsmark. Germany then began to see stability in their currency, but at the price of high unemployment due to monetary and fiscal policy. As always, that's when unemployment rises so, the extreme political points of view begin to get more foothold as great numbers of disenfranchised rally around one or the other banner that promises relief. Of course, Hitler started laying the framework well before the unemployment of the 30's, but once the idled hands hit the streets...
 
FremontPC,

Yes, agreed, that is certainly a precursor to the coming political climate of the time. The biggest factor of the hyperinflation was the inability, shortsightedness, or whatnot of the government to tax it's people to stabilize the economy, instead, they turned to taking on debt/borrow instead. It was the monarchy under Keiser Wilhelm that made those decisions. It is rumored and some evidence would suggest that foreign investment banks (most notably JP Morgan Chase) who helped speed along the hyperinflation process because agreements between them failed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation_in_the_Weimar_Republic


Either way, yet again, the effort to reduce/eliminate taxes at all costs and take on debt.. another parallel to the US and other countries to that of Germany.

Eerily akin to our most recent market crash in many aspects:
The cause of the immense acceleration of prices that occurred during the German hyperinflation of 1922–23 seemed unclear and unpredictable to those who lived through it, but in retrospect was relatively simple. The Treaty of Versailles imposed a huge debt on Germany that could be paid only in gold or foreign currency. With its gold depleted, the German government attempted to buy foreign currency with German currency,[31] an action equivalent to selling German currency in exchange for payment in foreign currency, but the resulting increase in the supply of German marks on the market caused the German Mark to fall rapidly in value, which greatly increased the number of Marks needed to buy more foreign currency. This caused German prices of goods to rise rapidly, increasing the cost of operating the German government, which could not be financed by raising taxes because those taxes would be payable in the ever-less-valuable German currency. The alternative was some combination of running a budget deficit and simply creating more money, each of which increased the supply of German currency on the market and reduced that currency's price. When the German people realized that their money was rapidly losing value, they tried to spend it quickly. This increase in monetary velocity caused still more rapid increase in prices, creating a vicious cycle.[32] This placed the government and banks between two unacceptable alternatives: if they stopped the inflation this would cause immediate bankruptcies, unemployment, strikes, hunger, violence, collapse of civil order, insurrection, and revolution.

Too big to fail.
 
The situation in Nazi Germany
was quite a bit more complex than you have laid out (Or that is even reasonable to discuss here at length due to the breadth of the subject).

Timeline and story of the government wasn't my point...else I'd have pulled from memory a lot of deets. My point was the overall morale of the German people, the general population. (since it was brought up in a prior post trying to make an analogy with the American population) Lots of people a generation (or two or three or more in most cases here on these forums)...hate Germans, because of WWII. They stereotype the German people ...thinking Germans overall hated the Jewish. When in fact, the overall population was not what people think they were. You have to read different books than just straight history of political parties to get that, or better yet...hear it first hand...from relatives. Being old enough where my parents were around for WWII, and relatives who served in WWII...one of which I can't believe is still alive and I grew up hearing his memoirs and encounters with the people of Germany. Plenty of accurate shows such as you see on History Channel and similar stations...with interviews and behind the scenes facts.

Similar with the Japanese. Majority of the population wasn't as the media made them out to be, just because a crazy government went on the Pacific domination spree.

IMO, if people hate their government and country so much...move out! Go expatriot to Canada or South America or elsewhere. I still have a love for my country...as well as many countries...even though I don't like where our government is heading in the past few terms...and especially under the obummer regime, I don't hate the country. I highly doubt the government will ever revert back to a properly functioning body...as I said earlier...the POTUS has become just a puppet. Congress has become a joke...nothing can move without them and they make sure of it...parking brake is on full lock. And the big decisions are made behind the scenes with lots of dollars pushing agenda...by people that aren't elected into our government, yet they call the shots. Monsanto and Koch bros as examples.
 
Simply because you say so doesn't make it true. Last time I looked, far-Right extremists have performed almost twice as many attacks on th.e US than Jihadists since 9/11.. so where's your concern for homegrown terrorism and why isn't that issue #1? Homegrown terrorism since 9/11 is responsible for almost double the amount of deaths as well.

Simply because you deny they are at war with us doesn't make it go away. Also please show your source on the totals, only let's compare apples to apples this time. Far right to far left and/or devout Christians to devout Muslims. Comparing a wing of a political party to a religion is a false narrative.
 
Simply because you deny they are at war with us doesn't make it go away. Also please show your source on the totals, only let's compare apples to apples this time. Far right to far left and/or devout Christians to devout Muslims. Comparing a wing of a political party to a religion is a false narrative.

Why do I always have to do all the research?
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/25/u...llenges-perceptions-of-top-terror-threat.html
http://securitydata.newamerica.net/extremists/deadly-attacks.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...out-terrorism-in-the-united-states-since-911/
http://time.com/3934980/right-wing-extremists-white-terrorism-islamist-jihadi-dangerous/

Your turn, show me where "they" have literally declared war against the US.

Perhaps you can clear up the false narrative part and political parties and religion. Not sure where your coming from.
EDIT: As a contrast, why do "we" get to blame all Muslims and an entire faith system, as a whole, for the actions of middle-East political sects? Wouldn't that be a false narrative as well? Maybe I have misunderstood your point.

Stonecat, I agree almost fully with your last comments. I would just point out, In the same right, the US population wants to get out of the wars and stop doing what we're doing. The propaganda against "brown" people is, well.. prevalent.
 
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I wanted to see because your sources are junk.
Based on this garbage:

http://securitydata.newamerica.net/extremists/deadly-attacks.html. It is the source of your articles.

It doesn't even take more than a second or two to see just how inaccurate it is. Where is John Allen Muhammad? he killed 10. Not listed in the totals. Why is that? Oh wait, silly me. If a RWNJ kills a bunch of people then it is home grown terrorism. If a LWNJ kills a bunch of people it is because of the NRA and gun laws.
 
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