Depositing Clients' Cheques Using Mobile App

[britechguy]

I love the e-transfer system we have in Canada. We rarely see cheques any more and funds are in our account almost instantly.

Something very similar does exist in the USA in the form of the Zelle App. But here, and with it, a great deal of care needs to be exercised as it's pretty much a "once you pull the trigger, it's gone and you can never get it back" system (which is somewhat insane, in my opinion).

One of my clients (and a savvy senior, no less) uses Zelle and loves it. There have, unsurprisingly, been issues with fraud (not for her, but generally). From the New York Times in March: Fraud Is Flourishing on Zelle. The Banks Say It’s Not Their Problem.

 

[Larry Sabo]

"once you pull the trigger, it's gone and you can never get it back" system (which is somewhat insane, in my opinion).

I don't see why it's insane; if you had paid in cash you wouldn't get your money back from the fraudster either.

 

[britechguy]

Electronic transactions (whether credit card or EFTs) can be traced end-to-end. In cases of fraud (or even just a mistake, they do happen) it should be very easy to reverse the transaction.

I just had a "clerical error" not of my own making on my credit union's electronic bill payer. Should I have been "on the hook" for that error? I don't think so. If a transaction is end-to-end traceable it can be reversed, the banks just don't want to "be bothered." That's why I pretty much stick to credit cards, there are laws that protect the card holder.

 

[lcoughey]

Electronic transactions (whether credit card or EFTs) can be traced end-to-end. In cases of fraud (or even just a mistake, they do happen) it should be very easy to reverse the transaction.

I just had a "clerical error" not of my own making on my credit union's electronic bill payer. Should I have been "on the hook" for that error? I don't think so. If a transaction is end-to-end traceable it can be reversed, the banks just don't want to "be bothered." That's why I pretty much stick to credit cards, there are laws that protect the card holder.

I have no idea what the Zelle App is, but it does not sound anything like the e-transfer system provided by banks in Canada. Basically, it is a digital system that is connected to Interac where I can request my bank send funds directly to another bank, similar to doing a transaction with my bank card. The bank has a log of the transaction and it is about as secure as can get.

...and, it is nowhere as complex as direct wire transfers.

 

[lcoughey]

I should also add, there are no fees to receive the funds and tend to cost the sender an extra 75 cents.

 

[britechguy]

@lcoughey

What you describe in Canada is pretty much what Zelle provides here in the USA. It started out as a "bank to bank" system that was then opened up for customers to use. I will simply refer you to the NYT article which does a good job of summarizing its history, if I recall correctly.

It's a direct transfer system, no fees, and the funds leave the senders account and are instantly available in the destination account as soon as the transaction is processed. The problem being, here and with Zelle, there are no protections for fraud or just simple mistakes, and we all know that human beings can and do make typos when setting things up and I'd be mighty ****** if I transferred $15K thinking it went one place, but it went another by accident, and had no way to insist the transaction be reversed.

Given that Canada generally has much better consumer protections, I doubt this sort of thing is an issue there.

 

[lcoughey]

It seems to me that you need to have an account with a 3rd party vendor, Zelle and then connect your bank account to it.

Here in Canada, the option to send funds via e-transfer is built right into our banking websites and mobile apps, using the same network used to handle bank cards at bank machines or point of sale systems for over 40 years.

 

[britechguy]

Here in Canada, the option to send funds via e-transfer is built right into our banking websites and mobile apps, using the same network used to handle bank cards at bank machines or point of sale systems for over 40 years.

Well, we have something similar to that in most online banking apps in what typically gets called the "bill payer." But whether the funds are transferred electronically or not depends directly upon whether the recipient is set up and wishes to receive them that way. If they don't then a check is cut and sent at no charge. I even transfer funds between institutions using "bill payer" but it's EFT function. But even via EFT the result is not instantaneous on the receiving end. It's generally next business day.

It definitely doesn't use the same system as credit/debit card POS, though. It seems more like a sped-up version of ACH, which has handled checks "forever."

 

[britechguy]

It's interesting that mere hours after I posted that link to the NYT article from March, a brand, spankin' new one from today has rotated to the "online front page."

When Customers Say Their Money Was Stolen on Zelle, Banks Often Refuse to Pay​

 

[cypress]

Is there a dollar limit anywhere? i.e. maximum single check amount, daily deposit limit, etc.

If I deposit a check today will it be posted and available tomorrow morning? (It is with my scanner that I pay $50 a month for)

Daily limit is $7,500 and with Chase the full amount is usually available by the next business day. If I deposit a check the same day of let's say $300 they will release $150 of it up front the remaining will post tomorrow. Generally I am not depositing a check more than $1,000 though.

 

[mark-tech]

Similar to what @cypress stated, we also have experience with Chase and they have been working well. One time we had a check written by a client that had messy handwriting that was misinterpreted by the ai system so they emailed us and i called in and it was fixed in a day. Limits apply on check deposits normally around the $1500-2000 range or so but I think it depends on the account and how new they are.

 

[timeshifter]

we also have experience with Chase and they have been working well

Are you using your phone for deposits or are you on the $25 or $50 plan with a scanner?

 

[mark-tech]

@timeshifter

phone

 

[DRPCNZ]

Cheques, they were those paper things that people wrote out for payment when they didn't have funds to pay you. I JEST sort of. New Zealand stopped using cheques march 2022. As a country we had about 5 years of mumbling by banks that they were going to stop accepting or issuing cheques, and the mumbling got louder each year. 3 years ago we were down to only 1 company processing cheques from 2 companies, and the usage had been dropping 10% year on year

 

[HCHTech]

New Zealand stopped using cheques march 2022.

If only. Given the USA's archaic banking system and political lobbying system, I'm guessing we've got another 20 years before we move on from checks - which will be long after I'm out of the game.

 

[jzukerman]

I would say the majority of my clients unfortunately pay by check. It's annoying for several reasons:

1. The US Post Office is taking nearly 5-7 business days to deliver first class mail now. Sometimes longer.
2. The US Post Office has lost client checks sent to my office on several occasions.
3. Having to wait for funds to clear.
4. Scanning 5-10 checks with the mobile app is tedious/time consuming.
5. Sometimes I scan the check into the wrong account, or the app doesn't read the check correctly and end up having to go to the bank to deposit in person.

Ideally all clients would pay by EFT/ACH or credit card. But I'm not there yet so it is what it is.

 

[cypress]

Yeah about 60% of my clients still pay with checks.

 

[DRPCNZ]

If only. Given the USA's archaic banking system and political lobbying system, I'm guessing we've got another 20 years before we move on from checks - which will be long after I'm out of the game.

As a country we also only have a population of 5.5 million so considerably easier for us to do this. As a country we are also very quick to use tech for payments such as debit and credit cards. I am not sure if it still happens but most banking changes were always tested here then rolled out to where ever

 

[HCHTech]

The US Post Office is taking nearly 5-7 business days to deliver first class mail now. Sometimes longer.

We've noticed this as well - sign of the times. In an ideal world clients would recognize this and cut their check a couple of days earlier - HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

I've also noticed an increase in the amount of time required for vendors to receive payments made with my bank's online billpay. I have a car loan from a bank one state over, and it takes 7 business days for a payment from my bank's online billpay to be credited against the loan account. 7! That can be 10 or 11 calendar days, and this is from one bank to another. It's madness.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Wells Fargo just informed me that a single chargeback now costs $25. So I'm thinking accepting credit cards is now officially stupid.