Windows 11 problems

[Sky-Knight]

@Barcelona Valve has its own OS...

SteamOS

SteamOS is Valve’s Linux-based operating system. It features a seamless user experience optimized for gaming, while retaining access to the power and flexibility of a PC, and plays tens of thousands of games on Steam. SteamOS officially ships on Steam Deck, and will soon ship with certain Legion...

store.steampowered.com

Also, look VERY carefully at this: https://store.steampowered.com/about/

See that nice big blue Install Steam for Windows button? Now look below it... There's an Apple there... duh and a Steam icon.

That steam icon is aimed at a .deb file... that is to say, an installer for Steam that works on Debian derived OSs, like Ubuntu and hordes of others.

Now it's by far a minority of games on the platform that support Linux, but there are more there than you'd think. So Steam requiring Windows is rapidly becoming at thing of the past. And if Valve ever gets their streaming service online it will completely become a thing of the past.

Valve is investing HEAVILY in ensuring Microsoft holds no sway over gamers. Now while I've moved all purchases I can onto GOG to skip out on DRM. I do happily champion Valve's efforts to give us all OS choice for gaming.

P.S. Signal has a .deb installer for Debian derived disties too...

 

[GTP]

Agreed but you're neglecting Cedega, WINE and a few other emulators that run a very large and growing list of "Windows only" programs.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Agreed but you're neglecting Cedega, WINE and a few other emulators that run a very large and growing list of "Windows only" programs.

Didn't intend to... but at the same time have you tried those things? It's more tinkering than gaming.

 

[Blues]

I have done limited testing with Linux systems and Windows software but the results I have seen so far were surprisingly good. I will add that most of my testing was with old software which I was curious to test and see how and if I could get any of it working. I look at Linux and see potential but as stated by I believe @britechguy the number of various OSes is a problem however in some instances it is one of the benefits. You can find niche OSes designed around specific utilities which can simplify setup for utility devices ie NAS.

 

[Galdorf]

New laptop only a few months old shipped with windows 10 customer wants 11 this thing is a strix rog G512li laptop won`t upgrade to windows 11 and nuked it installed windows 11 would not complete the install tried a number of times kept erroring now i am getting even more new laptops that are windows 11 ready and they will not upgrade or even install windows 11 no wonder there are so few with windows 11.

 

[GTP]

New laptop only a few months old shipped with windows 10 customer wants 11 this thing is a strix rog G512li laptop won`t upgrade to windows 11 and nuked it installed windows 11 would not complete the install tried a number of times kept erroring now i am getting even more new laptops that are windows 11 ready and they will not upgrade or even install windows 11 no wonder there are so few with windows 11.

Works for me.

 

[Geeks On Command]

Works for me.

New laptop only a few months old shipped with windows 10 customer wants 11 this thing is a strix rog G512li laptop won`t upgrade to windows 11 and nuked it installed windows 11 would not complete the install tried a number of times kept erroring now i am getting even more new laptops that are windows 11 ready and they will not upgrade or even install windows 11 no wonder there are so few with windows 11.

Try using Rufus, it has an option in the drop down that circumvents the need for TPM and has worked for me on every machine that wouldn’t otherwise take windows 11.

 

[Diggs]

The generation of CPU they will let slide, TPM and Secure boot they will not.

Actually I found out they won't let it slide. I have a HP laptop with TPM 2.0 and secure boot but Win11 refuses to install because the 7th gen Core i3 is not on their approved hardware list. It's the only thing that shows up on their reason not to install list. Everything else is checked green. Really MS? That's BS!

 

[britechguy]

Really MS? That's BS!

Serious question: Why?

There has to be some arbitrary dividing line, for every aspect, and the 8th gen and newer Intel processor has been a part of that in addition to the TPM and secure boot requirements.

It's all arbitrary, and no matter where the dividing line is placed someone is going to declare it BS.

 

[nlinecomputers]

Actually I found out they won't let it slide. I have a HP laptop with TPM 2.0 and secure boot but Win11 refuses to install because the 7th gen Core i3 is not on their approved hardware list. It's the only thing that shows up on their reason not to install list. Everything else is checked green. Really MS? That's BS!

Is that a fresh install or upgrade? I was able to install nuke and pave on a Lenovo T460s. It would not upgrade but it did the N&P.

 

[Diggs]

Is that a fresh install or upgrade? I was able to install nuke and pave on a Lenovo T460s. It would not upgrade but it did the N&P.

Both through the automatic upgrade and running setup from an ISO on a USB stick. I did not try a clean install from boot.

 

[nlinecomputers]

Both through the automatic upgrade and running setup from an ISO on a USB stick. I did not try a clean install from boot.

Which will not work. You can only cheat the CPU requirements from a nuke and pave.

 

[Diggs]

Serious question: Why?

Because it meets the requirements of TPM and Secure Boot which are not arbitrary and a valid requirement. Those are distinct requirements. Which gen the Core i processor is does not effect the security like TPM and SB.

 

[nlinecomputers]

Because it meets the requirements of TPM and Secure Boot which are not arbitrary and a valid requirement. Those are distinct requirements. Which gen the Core i processor is does not effect the security like TPM and SB.

Which doesn't take into account the spectre and meltdown vulnerabilities. There are software patches, but software patches can be defeated. Can't have an issue with hardware that doesn't have the problem, to begin with. It is a valid issue.

 

[britechguy]

And, in the end, when it comes to Windows, Microsoft gets to decide what is "a valid issue." When it comes to MacOS/iOS, it is Apple that gets to decide what is a valid issue. Lather, rinse, reeat.

It's not our product, it's not us maintaining it at the code level. We don't get to make a lot of choices. 'Twas ever thus, and ever shall be.

 

[Sky-Knight]

Which doesn't take into account the spectre and meltdown vulnerabilities. There are software patches, but software patches can be defeated. Can't have an issue with hardware that doesn't have the problem, to begin with. It is a valid issue.

Not to mention the MASSIVE performance losses that come with OS level mitigations. My single core performance of this i7-4930K I've been using for over a decade now is HALF what it once was, a situation that's only going to grow worse with time.

Time to upgrade.

 

[nlinecomputers]

And, in the end, when it comes to Windows, Microsoft gets to decide what is "a valid issue." When it comes to MacOS/iOS, it is Apple that gets to decide what is a valid issue. Lather, rinse, reeat.

It's not our product, it's not us maintaining it at the code level. We don't get to make a lot of choices. 'Twas ever thus, and ever shall be.

Yet they also add an out. You CAN install Windows 11 without hacked modifications on a clean system. MacOS will not install on unsupported hardware. Microsoft claims that they will not support it but why offer it at all then? And frankly, we all know that they WILL support it anyway. Just like they support upgrades to Windows 10 even though the program is officially closed.

They offer this out so it will discourage pirated hacked copies. Microsoft knows that a small percentage will never pay for it and will use hacked copies to get it so they on the sly offer these free go-arounds just to protect the paying user base from potential botnets a hacked warez market would likely harbor. True pirated copies of Windows 10 are very rare because anyone can get a free copy just by joining the insider group and then leaving it. You end up with a copy of WIndows that is illegally licensed yet otherwise works and that is by design, not an oversite.

 

[Diggs]

You can only cheat the CPU requirements from a nuke and pave.

A USB ISO boot installed Windows 11 without an issue on the 7th gen Core i3. (...and killing the networkconnection during the setup enabled a local account) I really don't mind tying to an online account but when setting up refurbished machines in the shop without a known owner it's just not practical.

 

[nlinecomputers]

A USB ISO boot installed Windows 11 without an issue on the 7th gen Core i3. (...and killing the networkconnection during the setup enabled a local account) I really don't mind tying to an online account but when setting up refurbished machines in the shop without a known owner it's just not practical.

For that, you should use Sysprep. It is how you are supposed to set up Windows for future sales. But I would not sell Windows 11 this way. My prediction of unofficial support of nonspec hardware is just my wild guess and I could be proven wrong. I already have been. I initially said that I figured Windows 11 would install even without TPM and that guess of mine proved wrong. I'd really hate to sell Windows 11 only to have it suddenly not upgrade any longer.

 

[Diggs]

For that, you should use Sysprep.

It's just a personal thing. I don't like using sysprep and I don't like confusing my customer with the OOBE. Most have no clue and don't want to deal with the OOBE questions having no idea how it affects them and their computer. I set up most of my refurbished computers with a local account with the name Sparky. Most customers love the idea of a new sidekick named Sparky. I ask them all if they want me to change to their name and I've only had one taker that I can remember. Obviously with the online requirements of WIn11 this may be changing.

But I would not sell Windows 11 this way.

No worries. I stand behind what I sell and if by chance I have to replace it sometime in the future so be it. I'm not worried about it. The $$$ are minor.