Watch out for damaged computers

There comes a point where you have to admit defeat and just fix the entire thing for the client. I've had to do it in the past, not many times, less than a handful of times but you gotta do what you gotta do. I know it's hard as heck to admit defeat like that, trust me I'll be the first to stand my ground. But I've learned so much throughout the years that I know now that it's easier to fix it for the client than go through all the court fees even if it's small claims court.

I sold a laptop for about £100, client bought it back in a few days later not working, the HDD was making horrendous noises and the cd rom drive wouldn't stay latched closed.
I knew he had dropped it but had no way to prove it, I had a spare used HDD in but had to pay out of my pocket for a replacement optical drive as none of the spares we had fit it.


Also as for the OP, I REALLY check all PCs over in front of the customer so they know I have checked it over, some even ask "what are you looking for?" I don't care who you are I am checking over for ANY damage beforehand, as I cannot afford to be bitten like this. Sometimes the people that appear nice are the douches and vice versa, you can never judge a book by it's cover so for that reason I thoroughly check all PCs over and I even record any notable scratches.

Good luck in court though fella :)
 
PCX-- What are you using to run HDD diagnostics that's finding so many failures? I use Parted Magic's disk health check SMART readings and to run, at the very least a short test and a conveyance test on everything just to make sure it wasn't damaged on the way back to the shop (potholes can be pretty nasty around here this time of year, lol). Yeah, I do find the occasional bad drive, but for the most part the tests come back clean.

Are you using something more in-depth that I just haven't come across yet?

If you are only doing a short test and conveyance test, then you are not going to find much. We always run a short test and then an extended test if the short test fails. We are using gsmartcontrol, which is the same tool on Parted Magic.
 
Honestly, if you have been business for 11 years and you are just now implementing a physical inspection upon check-in and you still have not started doing even a basic diagnostics like a HDD test, then maybe it is time to go over your policies and procedures manual and make some changes. I wish you the best of luck.

this is the best advice. I always do a full daig just to make sure something like this doesnt happen. Customers can be scamers better to know what is wrong right away.
 
Here's the thing to argue. Customer brought the machine to you wanting it cleaned so they knew something was going wrong but didnt know what. We know that hard drives failing can make fast systems slow. This might be a way to argue your point.
 
Do you have security cameras set up in your store? Bring a DVD of the recordings from the entire time you've had the laptop in your possession and it'll prove that you never dropped the laptop. Then he has nothing to say!
 
SMART is almost worthless....

I've said it probably half a dozen times around here but I can promise you that I've had plenty of bad drives that SMART thinks are alright.
 
Do you have security cameras set up in your store? Bring a DVD of the recordings from the entire time you've had the laptop in your possession and it'll prove that you never dropped the laptop. Then he has nothing to say!
I'm no lawyer, but I don't think you have to prove you didn't cause the damage. It's up to the customer to prove that you did. I won a $4,500 small claims court case because the person responsible for delivering something on my behalf couldn't prove that it was delivered to the party who was to act on it. That party didn't have to prove they never received it--an impossible task, really.
 
I'm no lawyer, but I don't think you have to prove you didn't cause the damage. It's up to the customer to prove that you did. I won a $4,500 small claims court case because the person responsible for delivering something on my behalf couldn't prove that it was delivered to the party who was to act on it. That party didn't have to prove they never received it--an impossible task, really.

That's my way of thinking about this, otherwise everyone would be suing everyone for everything lol.
 
Well there are problems... many problem. Most of them are not your fault but they are your problems unfortunately.


You are NOT at fault, so most likely this guy is trying to scam you. If he is, it is unlikely he will sue you because he will have to pay the Small Claims Court Fee. Generally people won't take it this far when they themselves don't believe you damaged the computer.


Fixing a cracked case isn't exactly cheap or easy because you would have to resort to going to eBay to get it then find the instructions for that model laptop and spend .75 to 1.5 hours labor to swap all the parts.


Going to court is actually MORE expensive than settling because your time has value AND it harms your reputation even if you prevail. There will ALWAYS be a case logged in public records against you though the disposition may be that you are found not-guilty it still doesn't look good to be sued. Not that anyone is likely to check.:D


You probably cannot force him into Circuit Court or Superior court for a small-claim. Even if you could, it would require you first hire a lawyer and pay out more than the cost of his $750 laptop. You can generally only get into the higher courts for cases > $3000, $5000, $7000 (whatever it varies in different states).


Remember he does NOT have a right to a jury trial! Only the accused (defendant) has a right to request that. Not saying the court wouldn't grant it if asked only that it is pretty unlikely and if they did he would certainly have to pay the extra court fees.


The Burden of proof is ALWAYS on the Plaintiff! However, the burden is only preponderance of the evidence. In other words he need only convince the judge that more likely than not it is your fault... doesn't really have to prove that burdon beyond a reasonable doubt (it's not a criminal case)


Before you go:

1. Get the depreciated/replacement value of that 2 year old laptop. Price similar, used laptops of the same make/model/vintage and specs. Find the AVERAGE price where an AVERAGE person could actually REASONABLY replace it. (I.e. Just because one person won one on ebay for $40 doesn't mean it is valued at only $40)

Basically, IF the plaintiff wins (unlikely), he still has to prove damages and then add a monetary value to those damages. He isn't going to get $750 on a two-year-old laptop that was $750 in late 2010... Maybe $400 + court costs if he is lucky :D


I say fight him because you don't' have much to loose in court and you shouldn't give into a scam artist.

More likely than not he will just pick up his laptop and take it somewhere else in town and pull the same stunt until someone else pays. I would send EVERYONE an email about the laptop make/model/serial for them to get it time-stamped. Tell them if he comes in to take the laptop and see if they claim damages (fraud) and to call the police.... Maybe you can catch him trying the same thing with the same laptop for the same damage.


If you settle get it in writing that he agrees to hold you harmless hereinafter, blah blah blah for laptop serial number ******... and that he takes $xxx.xx as full restitution.
 
If you are only doing a short test and conveyance test, then you are not going to find much. We always run a short test and then an extended test if the short test fails. We are using gsmartcontrol, which is the same tool on Parted Magic.

gSmartControl... thanks (couldn't remember what it was called for sure, lol)

I run the extended test on most drives that come in... but every drive gets at least a short & conveyance test.
 
Honestly, if you have been business for 11 years and you are just now implementing a physical inspection upon check-in and you still have not started doing even a basic diagnostics like a HDD test, then maybe it is time to go over your policies and procedures manual and make some changes. I wish you the best of luck.
+2
Thank you. This is Computer Repair 101
The VERY FIRST THING I TEST is the hard drive! Hello! There is no point in repairing a computer if the hard drive is failing. Always test the most common part that fails as step one of any repair.
Also this customer is jumping to conclusions. We don't know how the computer became damaged. It's still gonna look really stupid in court to say "I think the hard drive might have been going bad". Well didn't you test it?? You're a computer tech aren't you???

If you are only doing a short test and conveyance test, then you are not going to find much. We always run a short test and then an extended test if the short test fails. We are using gsmartcontrol, which is the same tool on Parted Magic.
+2
Short test only checks SMART. SMART only becomes alerted to bad sectors if and when those bad sectors are attempted to be accessed by the drive, which might take months... a year or more. Only a long scan can be thorough.
 
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We always run a short test and then an extended test if the short test fails.
I always thought that if SMART shows failure, you're done. If it doesn't but the Short test fails, you're done. If neither fails, then the Extended test would be run if you want to be more certain that the drive is healthy. Even after a healthy extended test, the drive manufacturer's test would be more reliable and might be indicated if the PC's behaviour makes us suspect the drive. I don't understand why you say you run the extended test if the short test fails.
 
I knew he had dropped it but had no way to prove it,

We had this problem a few times at my last job. We searched for a solution that would, and found these:

http://www.uline.com/BL_1057/Shockwatch-Clips

They are not very large, and typically, we were able to place them inside of an unused bay or under a keyboard. For tight fits, we trimmed them as needed. One box of them was paid for the first time someone dropped a new machine but brought it in claiming a defect. We didn't keep these a secret since in some cases they were in plain view. Now it isnt as easy with ultrabooks and such being so small and cramped for space, but it is a great system. I think there are smaller ones that are just the little vials, but I couldnt find them online.
 
We had this problem a few times at my last job. We searched for a solution that would, and found these:

http://www.uline.com/BL_1057/Shockwatch-Clips

They are not very large, and typically, we were able to place them inside of an unused bay or under a keyboard. For tight fits, we trimmed them as needed. One box of them was paid for the first time someone dropped a new machine but brought it in claiming a defect. We didn't keep these a secret since in some cases they were in plain view. Now it isnt as easy with ultrabooks and such being so small and cramped for space, but it is a great system. I think there are smaller ones that are just the little vials, but I couldnt find them online.

I like it!

I will try and find a UK supplier I think.
To be fair most people would be honest about it, just obviously this guy wasn't
 
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