W7 Hang on Shutdown

[Mainstay]

Customer has two W7 Pro workstations running on SSD's with recent fresh installs that are running a lot of software (all legit, all patched, all necessary for their operations).

They shutdown every night.

SOMETIMES, the shutdown hangs.

To counteract this I've left them shortcuts on their desktop that works 100% of the time:

shutdown.exe -s -f -t 0

1. They LOATHE this approach (yes, they have a visceral hatred for double clicking a button that is "non-standard"

2. They also do not like the window that sometimes pop-ups saying "Force shutdown" (even though this is only onscreen for seconds and is just the built in Windows 7 shutdown window).


ARGHHHHH!

Any ideas on how to map their shutdown button to act like a force shutdown?

Any way to suppress that force shutdown window?

Any thoughts on how to tell them to get over it!

 

[Markverhyden]

Buy a Mac!!!!! Ok just kidding, could not resist. What does event viewer show? Did you try a scheduled task?

 

[Mainstay]

Event viewer doesn't offer much.... for the most part it is just Windows Updates that OCCASIONALLY fail.

Truly a "no-big-deal"... but one that they feel is unacceptable and nag me about...

A scheduled task to do...?

Also, I have now implemented:
Navigate to "Computer Configuration" --> "Administrative Templates" --> "System" --> "Shutdown Options". Double-click "Turn off automatic termination of applications that block or cancel shutdown" on the right panel. In the new dialogue box popped up, set configuration option as "Enabled".

So I will see if that helps in any way.

 

[Moltuae]

Any ideas on how to map their shutdown button to act like a force shutdown?

I've done something similar previously; removed the option to shutdown then pinned my own shutdown button to the start menu instead. Just make a shortcut to a batch file containing the shutdown command, change the shortcut's icon to a shutdown icon, configure it to 'run minimised' (so the batch file doesn't pop up on screen) and pin it to the top of the start menu.

According to my notes, this is how to remove the existing shutdown controls from the start menu:

Create/edit a new DWORD of NoClose in:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explorer

Set NoClose to 1 to disable shutdown options.​

You can also remove Logoff, if required:

Create/edit a new DWORD of StartMenuLogOff in:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explorer

Set StartMenuLogOff to 1 to disable.​

 

[HFultzjr]

A couple of questions?

Instead of trying to create another method of shutting down, why not see why the original method is not working?

What happens when you do a normal shut down?
What happens when you do a restart vs. shutdown?
What happens when you logoff, then shutdown?
Does it shutdown and restart ok from safe mode?
What program, process, etc. is making it hang?
Are you sure they are waiting long enough for it to shut down? I have seen times when it has taken A LONG time to finally shutdown.
Are you sure there is not a "stuck" update? You've mentioned failed updates. Maybe clear out the updates that are downloaded that maybe trying to install while shutting down.

Personally, I would try to solve the original shutdown issue vs. creating a new method of shutdown.

Have you tried Windows Repair All In One? Seems to be fixing a lot of issues of late.

Just throwing out some other options!

Harold

 

[Markverhyden]

By the way that "Force Shutdown" window that pops up tells the user what is causing the delay. So that should provide a clue. And are these also the type of user that feels they do not need to open files in advance of shutting down?

 

[Mainstay]

According to my notes

thank you! - will investigate this approach.

Personally, I would try to solve the original shutdown issue vs. creating a new method of shutdown.

Well, normally I'd agree. But it happens 1 in 10 days. Maybe. And there isn't anything particularly obvious in eventvwr. They run a ton of software and yeah, this happens.

If I go on-site, it doesn't happen (not once).

What happens when you logoff, then shutdown?

That is interesting... hadn't considered that. Except, these guys want perfection, so having to log off first would be, I'm sure, unacceptable.

What program, process, etc. is making it hang?

I don't know, it is occuring behind the "Windows is Shutting Down" veil...

Are you sure they are waiting long enough for it to shut down?

They claim they are... and I somewhat believe them. Apparently a few times they've left it overnight and it still didn't go... so something got hung on shutdown. The problem is, when they call me they can't remember the day that this occurred, so I am needle in a haystacking the event logs.

Are you sure there is not a "stuck" update?

That was my approach to this. They are fully up-to-date (there WERE a few instances of stuck updates) but they've since had it happen again. I haven't gone back onsite to see if Windows Updates are again the culprit.

The crazy part is, the approach Moltue and I use works and it takes like 10 seconds to implement.

Have you tried Windows Repair All In One?

No I haven't - but will do so on next visit - that tool isn't well known to me and I hadn't considered it.

By the way that "Force Shutdown" window that pops up tells the user what is causing the delay.

Yes, that only appears for a second or two, and the listed programs all clear. They are annoyed that they have to see such information (!) They are bit snobby about this, as I'm sure you are gleaning.

It is the hang that *sometimes* occurs after that screen.

And are these also the type of user that feels they do not need to open files in advance of shutting down?

They are pretty disciplined... they close out of all running applications ahead of a shutdown... so I don't believe it is this.

I am pretty confident it is either

a) Windows Updates which occasionally fails/gets stuck on shutdown
or
b) a service that is failing to close

You guys have all provided awesome feedback and insight.

Thank you so much for the considered responses. Very helpful.

 

[phaZed]

My bet is on a service that is failing to terminate properly. Any LOB apps, accounting software that may be holding things up? I have seen some Antivirus software cause this type of problem but it is usually because there is something wrong with it or there are multiple AV's installed or not uninstalled fully.

 

[Markverhyden]

My bet is on a service that is failing to terminate properly. Any LOB apps, accounting software that may be holding things up? I have seen some Antivirus software cause this type of problem but it is usually because there is something wrong with it or there are multiple AV's installed or not uninstalled fully.

Utility type of software is what I was about to mention. anti-malware, utilities such as backup software, things like dropbox services. Wonder if there is a way to script a process kill list before executing the shutdown.

 

[Mainstay]

Any LOB apps, accounting software that may be holding things up

Accounting application + ton of design software. Some of the design software uses services that keep talking back to home base (I believe for validation + a sort of BITS engine)...

And I wouldn't want to mess with that... I can see fixing the shutdown issue (which I honestly think isn't an issue) only to get the call that they can't open their design files (oh lord, the humanity!).

Is there a way to monitor / log a full and complete shutdown sequence?

Like, closing app1, shutting down service1, and so on, all the way to black out? And have it do so while a service is hanging? I think not, but you guys have some interesting approaches that always give me more to add to my tool kit.


---------


The CRAZY part is that a shortcut that contains

shutdown.exe -s -f -t 0 w/ a shutdown icon can be made in 3 seconds, and it works 100% of the time.

They just don't like that because it isn't the way Bill intended.

 

[cyabro]

Have you tried enabling verbose modern see if that gives any more detail as to where the shutdown process is hanging?

Here's how:

If your edition of Windows has the Group Policy Editor, you can type gpedit.msc in start search and hit Enter.

Navigate to Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates > System. Now in the right pane, double-click on Verbose vs normal status messages. This setting is designed for sophisticated users that require this information. and directs the system to display highly detailed status messages.

If you enable this setting, the system displays status messages that reflect each step in the process of starting, shutting down, logging on, or logging off the system. Do note that if the “Remove Boot / Shutdown / Logon / Logoff status messages” setting is enabled, this setting will be ignored.

 

[Markverhyden]

The CRAZY part is that a shortcut that contains

shutdown.exe -s -f -t 0 w/ a shutdown icon can be made in 3 seconds, and it works 100% of the time.

They just don't like that because it isn't the way Bill intended.

In that case you can just do a scheduled task. Put the string in a file, name <somename>.bat, then Open Administrative Tools and then Task Scheduler. Then set the execution time after you know they will not be around. Of course that does not solve the "but I should not have to do this because I never had this problem with my XP computer".

 

[HFultzjr]

Sort of like taking your car to the shop and saying "but it was making that noise all the way here and now it isn't" Come a few days later and it's making that "noise" again. Been there, done that. Those kind of problems are hard to diagnose, but I'm sure someone can point you to a log/message that let's you know what the error was.

Good luck.

 

[HFultzjr]

In looking at your original post, I see that it is doing it on TWO workstations. I must have overlooked that my first read.
I'm leaning towards a software issue.
Do the 2 workstations have the exact same SSD and software installed?
Are there any other workstations, running the same OS, Specs, Software, Etc., but not experiencing the problem?

Long shot here... but could it be electrical related to just these 2 workstations?

 

[Vicenarian]

Not sure if this will help, but I know on Vista, sometimes freezing during shutdown can be fixed by disabling the page file, restarting, and then re-enabling it.

 

[Mainstay]

I'm leaning towards a software issue.

I am almost positive it is a hanging service.

The systems are not identical... and there are only two being used.

They are both newly installed (fresh installs w/ clean drivers etc.) and I really don't believe there to be a hardware or driver issue (different makes and models and the drivers are all pretty standard stuff - i.e., no weird crossfire setups or anything of that nature).

Do the 2 workstations have the exact same SSD and software installed?

No - different hardware, but 90% the same software.

sometimes freezing during shutdown can be fixed by disabling the page file, restarting, and then re-enabling it.

Ah - the reason I love these forums. I hadn't, and would not have, considered that solution. It probably isn't the answer, but it is a good thing to add to the "let's try this" bag of tricks I will throw at it on my next visit.

thank you all!

 

[Mainstay]

OK - situation resolved - and I'm not happy about it.

They "found the problem"... Acronis was taking too long to close the service.

And their solution?

You got it, they disabled Acronis.

So for the sake of a slow shutdown or the MAJOR inconvenience of using my shutdown.exe button, they have completely exposed their systems to risk by disabling their imaging system.

They are gleeful in their solution. I've written them a nice little, "ok, so just so we understand what you are doing here..." email.

.....

On an unrelated issue, I sometimes get stuck getting out of my car. Turns out, that damn seat belt always stays clicked in. But not to worry, I took some scissors and cut the strap, problem solved.

 

[Moltuae]

On an unrelated issue, I sometimes get stuck getting out of my car. Turns out, that damn seat belt always stays clicked in. But not to worry, I took some scissors and cut the strap, problem solved.

lol Good analogy!

Geez they sound somewhat stubborn/arrogant.

Well at least you know the cause now.

How about offering them an Acronis alternative, such as Reflect?

 

[HFultzjr]

Have you contacted Acronis support?

Looking through their forums, this seems to be an issue for others as well.

If you're a paid subscriber, give 'em a call.