I personally am not advertising right now because the yellow pages isn't due until March and I really don't want to swim in cheese with the pizza techs on CL. If anybody has a better idea, let me know. Anyway, it seems that the only way to defeat these is by booting into a VM and doing manual removal, right? I know that before I went on hiatus I was seeing fake AV's that would stop any scan of any antivirus software, even from a VM, and "eat" whatever real AV was on the target PC. I suppose we'll eventually have fake AV's that eat the hard drive. I know that the Russians tried a virus that literally encrypted everything, and they didn't give out a key to unencrypt it if you paid, they just ran up your card. Judging from the rage on forums like these they realized they crossed the line, if you totally destroy data and leave no method of retrieval, you will get a bunch of enraged Yankees.