I need a backup solution for (1) file.

[Sky-Knight]

PST file in Onedrive works fine.
PST file that's USED in Onedrive... not so much. (Outlook can't touch it)

Live PST file in non-OneDrive folder.
Script that copies it into a OneDrive folder nightly, .zip it up first to be nice.

 

[fincoder]

PST file that's USED in Onedrive... not so much. (Outlook can't touch it)

That also worked fine, until the January Windows update. Outlook opens it OK, the only issue was that OneDrive would not sync the PST file while open by Outlook. I used to tell people with that setup they should close outlook occasionally and leave the computer running for a while if they wanted their Outlook folders to be backed up to OneDrive. Same issue with free filesync utilities like syncback.

 

[Sky-Knight]

That also worked fine, until the January Windows update. Outlook opens it OK, the only issue was that OneDrive would not sync the PST file while open by Outlook. I used to tell people with that setup they should close outlook occasionally and leave the computer running for a while if they wanted their Outlook folders to be backed up to OneDrive. Same issue with free filesync utilities like syncback.

That is correct, you cannot copy the PST file if Outlook is open. use the task manager to kill outlook.exe, then copy the file, can be scripted.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

One of the ...quite a few problems....of the old way before this update that flat out stopped Outlook with it's PST in OD....is that even when you close Outlook, often it would still leave a few connections open to the file. Once in a while Outlook may not fully "let go" of its database.

Add to that....what antivirus might also be used. As some of them were horrible with PST files...adding to frequent corruption and the need for that ancient tool "scanPST".

OneDrive sync engine is a constant real time sync engine that updates all files that have any incremental changes. It is designed for standard Office files and other common flat file types. It was never designed to sync database files that are in use.

Just like decades ago...back in the days of POP or IMAP email being more common in businesses..Microsoft articles clearly stated that those files should never be mapped across a network. Yeah, we'd see some IT departments store those files on the server so they could be backed up by the servers nightly old tape backup. But the performance of the drive/volume on the server was absolutely crushed....as I mentioned above...each Outlook client sticks thousands of finders into its PST file. That's quite a load on a local hard drive. Imagine that across a network (oh lets add a TON more network traffic)...and then the load on the drive/volume of the server itself. TCQ stats of the servers drives was shoved down a deep hole dug all the way to china.

And then when some people complain about how frequently PSTs corrupt....I simply point "Well...look what you're doing!" An about face in Microsofts own words to "not do that!!!"

Sometimes reading the instructions by the vendor can help!

 

[Metanis]

2026. PST files. How quaint.

SQL Server had a live backup utility introduced 26 years ago.

 

[thecomputerguy]

I'm gunna give Safe-PST a try ... it's a bit dated but appears to be able to drop the PST into OneDrive.

 

[fincoder]

OneDrive sync engine is a constant real time sync engine that updates all files that have any incremental changes. It is designed for standard Office files and other common flat file types. It was never designed to sync database files that are in use.

If only the developers of OneDrive and Outlook were the same and PST files could be supported or excluded from OneDrive sync as deemed necessary. Oh wait...

In the early days of home 365 subscriptions and Microsoft encouraging users to allow the Documents folder to be part of OneDrive, PST files stored in Documents was very common. For several years, OneDrive flat-out refused to sync the entire Documents folder if it contained a PST. They fixed OneDrive to allow the Documents folder to sync when it had a PST file, and the PST file would sync OK when Outlook wasn't running. The problem that started with the Windows update a few weeks ago is clearly a bug.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

If only the developers of OneDrive and Outlook were the same and PST files could be supported or excluded from OneDrive sync as deemed necessary. Oh wait...

In the early days of home 365 subscriptions and Microsoft encouraging users to allow the Documents folder to be part of OneDrive, PST files stored in Documents was very common. For several years, OneDrive flat-out refused to sync the entire Documents folder if it contained a PST.

Yeah, I think it was Office 2010 that started defaulting the PST to under the Documents folder.
Didn't make sense, because the predecessor to OneDrive, called SkyDrive, came out in....2007 I think....and granted hardly anyone knew about it or used it. I do remember playing with it early on. But I never really paid attention to if a PST was in there because...well, we ran on Exchange Server...and even back then PSTs were dead/extinct to me.

SkyDrive evolved into OneDrive in 2014.

 

[fincoder]

The KB article I linked to on the previous page of this thread has been updated now says:

STATUS: FIXED
This issue has been fixed by Windows. To get the fix, run Windows Update until you see “You’re up to date”. At this point you have the fix.

Odd that it doesn't reference the actual update KB number that fixed the issue. I found it mentioned elsewhere, KB5078127 article here. Apparently it was released January 24, not sure why my client didn't get the update, or maybe they did but the PST was already damaged so the problem continued.

 

[thecomputerguy]

The KB article I linked to on the previous page of this thread has been updated now says:

STATUS: FIXED
This issue has been fixed by Windows. To get the fix, run Windows Update until you see “You’re up to date”. At this point you have the fix.

Odd that it doesn't reference the actual update KB number that fixed the issue. I found it mentioned elsewhere, KB5078127 article here. Apparently it was released January 24, not sure why my client didn't get the update, or maybe they did but the PST was already damaged so the problem continued.

Thanks for the info but I'm not gunna trust that after dumping WAY to much time into this stupid thing.

 

[fincoder]

Thanks for the info but I'm not gunna trust that

Yes I'm glad I didn't know the fix was already available and my customer agreed to my solution: re-add POP accounts as IMAP and move all PST email folders into an IMAP account.

 

[britechguy]

re-add POP accounts as IMAP and move all PST email folders into an IMAP account.

If I've got to do a ton of work, it won't be to keep any POP setup alive. No one has ever presented what I consider to be a legitimate, let alone compelling case, to continue using POP.

IMAP works whether you are using a single device or hundreds of devices, as is, out of the box, and the heavy lifting for storage (and, thus, backup, too) is on the server side. I've never had a client lose messages with IMAP (or Exchange) but I've seen some catastrophes, and more than once, with POP. Why this access method continues to be maintained for use by any email providers eludes me. It's time that POP be placed upon the trash heap of history, which is where it belongs.

 

[fincoder]

No one has ever presented what I consider to be a legitimate, let alone compelling case, to continue using POP.

Yes I agree. Even if they insist on using an ISP account with a dated email service and only 200MB max storage, it can still be configured as IMAP and a separate free account like Gmail for saved email folders does the job nicely. Worse case a PST file that isn't connected to an email account can be used for storage, and in that scenario it continued to work well even if situated in OneDrive during this recent glitch.

Incidentally, the default AutoArchive settings (if turned on) will create an archive PST file in Documents (often in OneDrive) and I've never heard of problems with that. Again, it's a PST file that isn't attached to a POP account, there doesn't seem to be any issues with offline PST files even if stored in OneDrive.

 

[thecomputerguy]

If I've got to do a ton of work, it won't be to keep any POP setup alive. No one has ever presented what I consider to be a legitimate, let alone compelling case, to continue using POP.

IMAP works whether you are using a single device or hundreds of devices, as is, out of the box, and the heavy lifting for storage (and, thus, backup, too) is on the server side. I've never had a client lose messages with IMAP (or Exchange) but I've seen some catastrophes, and more than once, with POP. Why this access method continues to be maintained for use by any email providers eludes me. It's time that POP be placed upon the trash heap of history, which is where it belongs.

Yeah ... I've got one guy who uses POP AOL Mail for his business and his employees and refuses to switch. He actually pays AOL. That and the only way to get POP working with AOL is to use an APP password and their APP password service has been broken since 2022.

He says he likes being able to login to AOL and then use Outlook with POP as a "backup" in case he accidentally deletes something out of AOL.

Same guy who refuses to use a eFax service.

It's the old folks, I've learned not to fight it, they are either slow to adapt or won't adapt and blame.

I just give them the correct recommendation and Bill more for stupid stuff like this since it ALWAYS takes more effort.

 

[britechguy]

It's the old folks, I've learned not to fight it, they are either slow to adapt or won't adapt and blame.

Many of my clients are "old folks." Heck, at age 60-plus I fall into that broad class. But the reason I won't do what you do is that they will blame, and that blame is virtually always for something they chose to do that's stupid.

My time as a therapist (speech-language pathologist) taught me that my clinical judgment, with reasonable consultation with the client, is what guides things. But if a client and I were completely at odds, I was not the therapist for them. That same basic philosophy applies to computer work as well. I simply won't do something that directly conflicts with my better judgment that comes from years of experience. You need someone else.

 

[callthatgirl]

If that's what it takes, set it up again. I have all these clients with the same issue and even though backup help isn't in my core services, I still tell them to make sure it gets backed up as it was moved from OneDrive, which is insane to even have it defaulted there in the first place lol.

FYI*, if clients ask, I setup carbonite and download their onedrive so it can be backed up to carbonite.

I don't support onedrive much anymore
I don't offer back up services.

Guess what I don't like doing anymore