don't believe everything you read

Galdorf

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don't believe everything you read i read this : http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/03/world/climate-change-report/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
Did some real research most areas are getting colder not hotter this summer in Canada has been coldest and wettest in history was so cool this summer only 2 days did i even need to turn on the AC.
This winter has already broke records all around the world and it's just starting expect record breaking cold.
If there was global warming should it not be a warmer winter..............
on Monday day it was -26C with wind chill hottest year i think NOT!.
 
Lol, that dhmo site is hilarious!

Galdorf, the rest of the world is waiting for your good news! Please share your compelling research!

:rolleyes:
 
I'm not a tinfoil hat guy, but it's an interesting topic.

Many people accept global warming because someone has told them it's happening despite their personal experience of longer/colder winters and cooler summers. And yes, I use "global warming" instead of the less politically charged "climate change". It isn't "change" certain groups are up in arms about - it's warming. And banging the warming drum has created careers and perceived importance for a butt-load of people. If it didn't exist, they wouldn't have a job. Kind of like racial tension and Al Sharpton. If it didn't exist, he'd create it.

This is a global forum - we have members EVERYWHERE. Over the last 10-20 years or more, who of you (and what is your location) have been experiencing milder winters and warmer summers?

I'll start. Over the last 20 years I've lived primarily in Chicago, northern Iowa and for the last 8 years, New Mexico. I can recall the occasional milder winter but it doesn't seem like a trend. If anything, during my short 50 years on earth and in the areas I've lived, winters have become harsher and summers cooler overall.
 
Many people accept global warming because someone has told them it's happening despite their personal experience of longer/colder winters and cooler summers. And yes, I use "global warming" instead of the less politically charged "climate change". It isn't "change" certain groups are up in arms about - it's warming. And banging the warming drum has created careers and perceived importance for a butt-load of people. If it didn't exist, they wouldn't have a job.

I disagree. People accept the notion of global warming because there is a huge mountain of data that would seem to support it. A persons (even your own) personal recollection of a whole year past is exactly the data you do not want to rely on. The data is all laid out for anyone to read and it comes from all types of sources and sciences; from many governments and nations. The data extends not only the last 50 or 100 years but even longer. Weather and climate data have been collected since the late 1700's in the U.S. - Data is collected from hundred-thousand-year-old tree rings all the way to the latest satellites, land stations, water buoys, weather balloons, ships, Navy, Coast Guard, etc. So, 100's (or 100,000's) of years of public data that correlates and corroborates the theory of Global Warming (Climate Change) is somehow to be discounted as a hoax or conspiracy because of job security? If that holds true then "they" have been actively "securing" their future for the last, what, 100 years? They somehow changed literally petabytes of information all over the world without anyone noticing.

Climategate has been debunked since 2009. Check out the link, very well laid out and pretty much not arguable anymore.

What always strikes me as strange is how climate change deniers have yet to provide their scientific evidence that there is no climate change. It would seem to me that if that evidence could be obtained or is available that they would instantly use that to further their goal... yet, climate change deniers are simply denying it based on rhetorical commercial and ideological reasons.

You want to know who is putting doubt into the public eye? The people who stand to lose the most due to our problems that are likely the cause as well.


You don't find this kind of action and corruption on the "Science side" of the debate:
The Guardian reported that after the IPCC released its February 2007 report, the American Enterprise Institute offered British, American and other scientists $10,000, plus travel expenses to publish articles critical of the assessment. The institute, which had received more than $US 1.6 million from Exxon and whose vice-chairman of trustees was former head of Exxon Lee Raymond, sent letters that The Guardian said "attack the UN's panel as 'resistant to reasonable criticism and dissent and prone to summary conclusions that are poorly supported by the analytical work' and ask for essays that 'thoughtfully explore the limitations of climate model outputs'." More than 20 AEI employees worked as consultants to the George W. Bush administration.[41] Despite her initial conviction that with "the overwhelming science out there, the deniers' days were numbered," Democratic Senator Barbara Boxer said that when she learned of the AEI's offer, "I realized there was a movement behind this that just wasn't giving up."[10]

The Royal Society conducted a survey that found ExxonMobil had given US$ 2.9 million to American groups that "misinformed the public about climate change," 39 of which "misrepresented the science of climate change by outright denial of the evidence".[6][42] In 2006, the Royal Society issued a demand that ExxonMobil withdraw funding for climate change denial. The letter, which was leaked to the media, drew criticism, notably from Timothy Ball and others who argued the society attempted to "politicize the private funding of science and to censor scientific debate."[43]

ExxonMobil denied the accusations that it has been trying to mislead the public about global warming. A spokesman, Gantt Walton, said that ExxonMobil's funding of research does not mean that it acts to influence the research, and that ExxonMobil supports taking action to curb the output of greenhouse gasses. Gantt said, "The recycling of this type of discredited conspiracy theory diverts attention from the real challenge at hand: how to provide the energy needed to improve global living standards while also reducing greenhouse gas emissions."[44]

Between 1989 and 2002 the Global Climate Coalition, a group of mainly United States businesses, used aggressive lobbying and public relations tactics to oppose action to reduce greenhouse gas emissions and fight the Kyoto Protocol. The coalition was financed by large corporations and trade groups from the oil, coal and auto industries. The New York Times reported that "even as the coalition worked to sway opinion [towards skepticism], its own scientific and technical experts were advising that the science backing the role of greenhouse gases in global warming could not be refuted."[45] In the year 2000, the rate of corporate members leaving accelerated when they became the target of a national divestiture campaign run by John Passacantando and Phil Radford with the organization Ozone Action. According to the New York Times, when Ford Motor Company was the first company to leave the coalition, it was “the latest sign of divisions within heavy industry over how to respond to global warming."[46][47] After that, between December, 1999 and early March, 2000, the GCC was deserted by Daimler-Chrysler, Texaco, the Southern Company and General Motors.[48] The organization closed in 2002, or in their own words, 'deactivated'.

Early in 2013, The Guardian revealed that two trusts, the 'DonorsTrust' and the 'Donors Capital Fund', operating out of a house in the suburbs of Washington DC, have bankrolled 102 think tanks and activist groups to the tune of $118m between 2002 and 2010. The conservative donors to these trusts are said to represent a wide range of opinion on the American right who have found common ground in opposing cuts to greenhouse gas emissions. They ensure their anonymity by funnelling the funds through the trusts, and the money flowed into "Washington thinktanks embedded in Republican party politics, obscure policy forums in Alaska and Tennessee, contrarian scientists at Harvard and lesser institutions, even to buy up DVDs of a film attacking Al Gore," the report said. The stream of cash was used to fund a conservative backlash against Barack Obama's environmental initiatives and to wreck any chance of Congress taking action on climate change. The money funded a vast network of thinktanks and activist groups working to redefine climate change from neutral scientific fact to a 'wedge issue' that benefits the hardcore right. Robert Brulle, a Drexel University sociologist who has researched other networks of ultra-right donors, said, "Donors Trust is just the tip of a very big iceberg."[19]

Later in 2013, The Guardian reported that the State Policy Network (SPN), an umbrella group of 64 US thinktanks, was involved in covert lobbying for major corporations and rightwing donors. SPN's policies are to oppose climate change regulation, as well as other causes including cutting taxes, advocating reductions in labour protection, restricting voter rights and lobbying for the tobacco industry. The report said that the SPN's funders for 2010 included AT&T and Microsoft, which each donated up to $99,000, Time Warner Cable, Verizon, the Koch brothers, the Walton family of Walmart, and Facebook.[49]
 
I'm not a tinfoil hat guy, but it's an interesting topic.

Many people accept global warming because someone has told them it's happening despite their personal experience of longer/colder winters and cooler summers. And yes, I use "global warming" instead of the less politically charged "climate change". It isn't "change" certain groups are up in arms about - it's warming. And banging the warming drum has created careers and perceived importance for a butt-load of people. If it didn't exist, they wouldn't have a job. Kind of like racial tension and Al Sharpton. If it didn't exist, he'd create it.

This is a global forum - we have members EVERYWHERE. Over the last 10-20 years or more, who of you (and what is your location) have been experiencing milder winters and warmer summers?

I'll start. Over the last 20 years I've lived primarily in Chicago, northern Iowa and for the last 8 years, New Mexico. I can recall the occasional milder winter but it doesn't seem like a trend. If anything, during my short 50 years on earth and in the areas I've lived, winters have become harsher and summers cooler overall.

You might find this chart interesting:

http://weather-warehouse.com/Weathe...ata_ChicagoMeigsField_Chicago_IL_January.html

Not specifically saying that I believe all that is fed me, but I prefer not to rely on my faulty and selective memory.

Rick
 
Global warming \ climate change - ice ages came aka cold and went aka warm long before we showed up.
Too much statement of planetery meltdown as a "FACT" in my opinion.

I saw a newspaper article that said you should'nt believe everything you read. So I checked online instead:p
 
Where i live there were quite a few winters with little to no snow and it was warm one winter which was really odd for a whole month it was like summer the snow melted and temps hit 20C ish for a whole month, funny thing is scientist could not explain it.
Also at that time a group of school kids in the US had gone on a school trip they all ended up with sun burn yet they were wearing winter gear.
Now it's polar vortex record breaking snow and cold each year colder than next.
 
According to NOAA so far this is the hottest year on record since 1880 when they began keeping track. http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/

Now 134 years of climate data compared to 4.5 billion years is pretty insignificant but why some of you scoff at science is beyond me.
 
If you still believe in "Global warming" you might be a liberal. Its one of the signs, along with several other anti-logic/ant-fact reality distorted views.

Great! We're all waiting for "the truth"! Please, let us in on the secret by providing sources that explain your logical, fact-based counter argument.

climate_change_political_affiliation.png

Who are the climate change deniers?

Turns out you might be a Republican as well seeing as 50% of republicans subscribe to the idea too. About 70% of the total US population accepts Climate Change.
 
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If you still believe in "Global warming" you might be a liberal. Its one of the signs, along with several other anti-logic/ant-fact reality distorted views.

Bring politics and/or religion into any debate, and the truth will invariably get lost.
 
I dont think the argument is 'climate change'. Climate change has been going on since the world began. So, If one where to argue for climate change I would say 'Yes' there is climate change. I really think people are kinda mixed up on their definitions. Climate Change and Man Made climate change are two different things. Therefore, The argument is actually "Man Made climate change - Are we causing it and is it killing the earth?".

For anyone that wants to argue that there is Man Made Climate Change and it is harming the earth they should spend a little time and watch this video by Lord Monckton. Its purely scientific and really cannot be argued with.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuj_tlRRQdQ

There are others but this is a good place to start.

Also, In a related post about this subject I posted a chart of climate data and asked where climate in the chart was stable? No one has answered it to my knowledge. For the record, Here is the chart once again.

All_palaeotemps_zps979e889b.png
 
Bring politics and/or religion into any debate, and the truth will invariably get lost.

Oh so true!

Man is definitely causing (perhaps irreparable) damage to the earth. Whether the weather has changed as a result isn't meaningless, but it should not be the only reason to take a hard look at ourselves and our actions.
We are like a virus, happily killing its host.
 
I dont think the argument is 'climate change'. Climate change has been going on since the world began. So, If one where to argue for climate change I would say 'Yes' there is climate change. I really think people are kinda mixed up on their definitions. Climate Change and Man Made climate change are two different things. Therefore, The argument is actually "Man Made climate change - Are we causing it and is it killing the earth?".

For anyone that wants to argue that there is Man Made Climate Change and it is harming the earth they should spend a little time and watch this video by Lord Monckton. Its purely scientific and really cannot be argued with.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuj_tlRRQdQ

There are others but this is a good place to start.

Also, In a related post about this subject I posted a chart of climate data and asked where climate in the chart was stable? No one has answered it to my knowledge. For the record, Here is the chart once again.

All_palaeotemps_zps979e889b.png

Life will go on and the Earth will continue to be habitable. The big question is what harm climate change will do to us. Will it inconvenience us or will it push our species to the brink of extinction?
 
For anyone that wants to argue that there is Man Made Climate Change and it is harming the earth they should spend a little time and watch this video by Lord Monckton. Its purely scientific and really cannot be argued with.

Lord Monckton? Really? Did you bother to do your research on this guy or did you just go with the first thing you saw? Sorry, but it is clear to see that Lord Monckton IS NOT basing his arguments on Science and has been caught changing the data (Like to that woman in the video) to support his claims. He cites studies and papers and then inserts his own data that doesn't even correspond to the study he is citing.
Lord Monckton has never written a single peer reviewed science paper on any topic. Gee, you think with such groundbreaking news (Anti-Climate Change) he would be taken seriously and he would be serious enough to publish his non-existent scientific research.

EDIT: Also, on a separate note - Because something is "purely scientific" doesn't mean it can't be argued with, in fact, exactly the opposite. Science is the practice of disproving theories, or arguing. The arguments must follow the scientific method and be repeatable in order to be considered valid, however.

Here's a presentation from John Abraham of University of St. Thomas which has been published in at least 80 scientific papers, conferences and patents. He lays out each of Monckton's claims and then debunks them, shows you the original report Monckton butchered and then even asks the actual scientists that published those works whether their work was quoted in or out of context, etc. - bottom line is Monckton is simply lying through his teeth and the data is in... Monckton is willingly misinforming.

Here's a site to read more about Monckton: Skeptical Science
So, what is your argument FOR Monckton? Just an interview with a Greenpeace idiot? Please, take the time to provide your evidence to debunk my claims and shed Lord Monckton in a better light.
Also, In a related post about this subject I posted a chart of climate data and asked where climate in the chart was stable? No one has answered it to my knowledge. For the record, Here is the chart once again.

Why are you waiting on computer business owners to tell you about Climate Change? Google that sh**! The chart you have posted is a macro overview of Earth's Climate for the past 500+ million years - so your resolution for the past few thousand years on that graph are not very useful... but you can still see it in your graph.. see that last bit for the past 2000-10,000 years? That's fairly stable there. The problem is that we are in a Solar cycle which promotes global cooling and we were and still are on a cooling cycle up until the industrial revolution.. the thing that is alarming and unusual is that the recent warming trend is happening regardless of the cyclical cycles and is occurring more rapidly than anytime before (Decades instead of multiple Centuries).

Here's your answer, the last 2000 years of Climate:
Fig.final_11.jpg


You are welcome to disprove Berkley:
Global land temperatures have increased by 1.5 degrees C over the past 250 years
Or Arizona University's international study:
https://www2.ucar.edu/atmosnews/news/846/arctic-warming-overtakes-2000-years-natural-cooling

... both of which explain why this is not normal or expected.
 
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I am not even going to argue about whether or not climate change is real, because there is no debate. Every winter it's the same hilarious statement from the right, without fail: look, snow!! See? NO GLOBAL WARMING.

Right then.

But I think a better thing to think about it is this--even if you think climate change is made up, does it really hurt anything to reduce our footprint on this earth? No, it does not. It hurts nothing to take a gentler approach and actually we have a lot to gain from it (including jobs).
 
Here's your answer, the last 2000 years of Climate:
Fig.final_11.jpg
Based on the chart above:

Year 1 - Avg Temp = -.1
Year 1900 - Avg Temp = -.5 - this is a 500% drop in temperature over 1900 years (global cooling?)
Year 2000 - Avg Temp = .3 - this is an 800% jump in 100 years (or a 400% jump over 2000 years)

So, if a 500% drop form -.1 to -.5 isn't alarming, then we should not be concerned with a 400% jump from -.1 to .3 as it would imply that the warmer temperature is closer to the original -.1 than the coldest temperature...just saying.

If you believe in a 100 billion year old planet, 2000 years, not even 1,000,000 years, is a significant number to work with to measure what the planet temperature should be. If you believe in a 6000 year old planet, the numbers line up quite nicely to the planet adjusting to a Biblical flood.
 
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