Cheating People

[seedubya]

As they say around here Gunslinger, make hay while the sun shines - and it's still shining.

 

[TimeCode]

I still think your prices are far too high and the more prices of computers drop the more business you will lose.

I respectfully disagree. My clients are too attached to the data that is on their PCs to think of getting rid of them. I often tell them that the old PC is not worth fixing and they should just buy a new one. They respect me for my honesty and about 50% of the time I end up fixing it for them anyway.

 

[gunslinger]

I guess my clients are smarter than that. When I have had a customer get a new PC they have requested most of the time that I connect their old drive as a slave so they can still get at their data. They are not so stupid as to think there is that much to it.

For what ever reason be it a new gen of people who are growing up around computers or have family that has, customers are getting smarter. As computers and flash memory get cheaper.

Its not at all uncommon for me to get to a customers house to find they have already backed up all of their important data to their new "8 gig flash drive thingy."

Slowly but surely computers will be going the way of the TV as far as pricing goes. I would say within the next 5-10 years most who have computers over a year old will replace rather than fix. I also think most will know how to save their important data to either media or in the cloud. The smarter the customers get the less a greedy tech will be able to get away with charging.

 

[Felix]

I guess my clients are smarter than that. When I have had a customer get a new PC they have requested most of the time that I connect their old drive as a slave so they can still get at their data. They are not so stupid as to think there is that much to it.

For what ever reason be it a new gen of people who are growing up around computers or have family that has, customers are getting smarter. As computers and flash memory get cheaper.

Its not at all uncommon for me to get to a customers house to find they have already backed up all of their important data to their new "8 gig flash drive thingy."

Slowly but surely computers will be going the way of the TV as far as pricing goes. I would say within the next 5-10 years most who have computers over a year old will replace rather than fix. I also think most will know how to save their important data to either media or in the cloud. The smarter the customers get the less a greedy tech will be able to get away with charging.

Sorry Gunslinger, but you usually seem to have a "You Vs. Everyone else" attitude. From what I've seen the area that you live in determines ones prices. In some cases maybe it is greed, but not everyone does this job out of charity. Doesn't mean we all want to rip people off, it just means that we need to get paid for our time.

 

[gunslinger]

Sorry Gunslinger, but you usually seem to have a "You Vs. Everyone else" attitude. From what I've seen the area that you live in determines ones prices. In some cases maybe it is greed, but not everyone does this job out of charity. Doesn't mean we all want to rip people off, it just means that we need to get paid for our time.

Sorry if it seems that way. I do feel differently about certain issues than most techies. I like Macs, I hate Vista with a passion, and I don't like ripping off customers. The reason I started working on computers in the first place was not to make a lot of money, It was to be able to fix my own computer because I was sick and tired of getting screwed over by "techies" that would charge $75-100 and not fix anything.

From what I've seen the area that you live in determines ones prices.

I will agree with you on this. Around here the average income is very low. People who only make $50-75 per day are just not going to pay a tech $100 per hour, nor should they.

 

[TimeCode]

I will agree with you on this. Around here the average income is very low. People who only make $50-75 per day are just not going to pay a tech $100 per hour, nor should they.

You are absolutely right and I am not going to argue that point.

But when I do a job for a lawyer in Beverly Hills, you can bet that I am charging full pop. I was there 4 hours the other day... To me that is $400. =) That almost makes it worth the drive.

 

[Nerm]

The company I work for charges a minimum of $75/hour during normal business hours with a minimum of one hour charge for on-site work and we are still way less expensive than our big name brand competitors (eg. EasyTech, Geeksquad, etc).

 

[seedubya]

I still think your prices are far too high and the more prices of computers drop the more business you will lose.

Prices HAVE dropped, Gunslinger. The relative cost today of mid-level PC vs. 13 years ago when I first got paid to do this is about 40%. In that time relative rates for a professional, experienced tech have about doubled. PC's themselves have become a commodity but data has not. Nor has technician's time. As PCs have become more and more important to people so they have become more willing to spend money on maintaining their PCs and retaining their data (mind you they still won't back up!!).

Also, I can go to my local hardware and buy a complete bathroom suite for about €300-€400 but when i go to get it fitted it'll cost me 3 or 4 times that amount. A complete kitchen on the other hand will cost me perhaps €8k but will only cost the same to install. The cost of the item is not related to the cost of service.

 

[Majestic]

Prices HAVE dropped, Gunslinger. The relative cost today of mid-level PC vs. 13 years ago when I first got paid to do this is about 40%. In that time relative rates for a professional, experienced tech have about doubled. PC's themselves have become a commodity but data has not. Nor has technician's time. As PCs have become more and more important to people so they have become more willing to spend money on maintaining their PCs and retaining their data (mind you they still won't back up!!).

Also, I can go to my local hardware and buy a complete bathroom suite for about €300-€400 but when i go to get it fitted it'll cost me 3 or 4 times that amount. A complete kitchen on the other hand will cost me perhaps €8k but will only cost the same to install. The cost of the item is not related to the cost of service.

Completely Agree.

 

[Fireddog]

When My partner and I started this company We realized based on our location ,the population and the clients in our area we needed to make about $320 a day on average. We
also understood that as we start we were not going to have the volume necessary to charge so Low. So we have minimums we set and we make sure to charge half of Retail service companies to start just because we want to grab the business to start. Now per client we are averaging with upsells about $200. So it works out.

I dealt with folks at our old company that were like gungslinger who undervalued their knowledge. They felt incorrectly.. that what they did was easy. No the truth is what We do is EASY for ourselves. Its like watching Michael Jordan he made it look easy. But I know I could never go on the court and duplicate him. I don't have his skills. Its why millions didnt mind paying those high ticket prices to watch him play.

I used to be a supervisor and I dealt with underlings who would give away business. I would be like why didn't you charge that person for what you just did? " WELL IT WAS easy for me?" Oh really so the next time they come back and its a SERIOUS problem you are going to charge em and they are going to say..Why? " Last time I was here it was free? ... Guess what to them what you did last time was just as hard for them as what you now consider REALLY hard. Because they couldn't do either task at all.

There is no difference to them. Frame of reference ...is the term I refer to . To the average client anything we do is hard for them. So Even if its easy for us.. They could never duplicate it. Never undervalue yourself.

Cause a good tech like myself who has a little sales men in them plus has the knowledge will do a great job still for the client and give them added value still above and beyond and still make money doing it. While you do just the bottom line and are satisfied with that.

 

[JRDtechnet]

I think the main differences are I love what I do and would be working on computers even if I was not getting paid. Where as you seem to be trying to get rich of off fixing computers even thought your not really into it at the expense of customers.

$35 per hour here is more than most of the people make in my state. I have no overhead, so its a very good living. My wife also brings in over $46,000 per year as a teacher. I could not sleep at night knowing I was ripping my customers.

You have a big pay off from a few customers and thats great, but if they are smart they will shop around after the first time and find someone who can do the job for less than half what you charge. After a while you will either have to relocate to find new business or find a new profession. With the way I do it, I'll make less money per customer but I'll get many loyal customers who will gladly hand out my cards to all of their friends and family. This brings even more business and long term success.

This may not work every where. Maybe You live in a place where people over pay for everything and expect high prices, but around here you would never, I repeat , NEVER get called out.

Yes, Gunslinger $35/hr is a lot....if your working for an employer and depending on the cost of living where you live. $35/hr works out to be around $72k for 8hr week/ 52weeks yr. That can buy you a big 5 bedroom house on 10 acres in some places and in other not even a townhouse. If someone offered me a job that guaranteed me $35/hr 8hrs a day I would actually think about taking it.

Now running a business and making $35/hr is a completely different monster. An employee drives to work, works 8hrs makes his $35/hr, drives home....and that's it no more worries.

A business owner though works from he gets up until he goes to sleep...where or not he is getting paid, has to field phone calls, promote their business, maintain their website (or pay someone else too), pay for insurance, "paperwork" etc. If your onsite business you'll have more wear and tear on your car, you'll be using more gas. If you have a store front you have to pay rent and utilities.

Lets say gunslinger that you average 40 billable hours a week @ $35hr. That's $1400 a week. Add at least 4hrs a day for non-billable work 4hs x 5 days = 20hrs (i won't even count weekends even though I should) 20hrs x $35 = $700 so now subtract that from $1400. Now your down to $700 a week just like that or another way of putting it you are making about $24/hr when you factor in 8hrs billable and 4 hrs non-billable.

Now subtract your gas, your insurance, car maintenance, how much are your REALLY making now?

It's great that you love what you do, I think everyone here does too. But my time is valuable, I am in business to make a living for myself not to work for free.

 

[mortaltech]

talk about ripping people off. i did a onsite call for geeks-on-site yesterday and they ripped an elderly lady off big time. because her address was at an assisted living home they charged her as a company at $297.00 for a 4hr block. they wanted me to stay there and bs her for another 1-1/2 hour to justify charging her that price. the job only took me an hour and thats all that i charged them for even though they only pay me $25 an hour and still charged her for the 4hr block. then they wanted me to sell their online service for $25 per month which i did not. i like to be honest and treat people like i would want to be treated

 

[gunslinger]

Now subtract your gas, your insurance, car maintenance, how much are your REALLY making now?

Still making more than the avarage person in my area. Thats the great thing about it. I do what I love and still make more than most. In fact I can work less than 40 hours a week and still make more than most here because of the websites I do. $400-$1500 per 6-8 weeks. Not much extra but it helps. I live in a nice middle class neighborhood, drive a Lincolin LS , have lots of nice things and still have money left over at the end of the month. What more could I ask for?

 

[Fireddog]

I don't want to make barely more then the average person.
I deal with a whole lot more and save alot more personal data for folks then any average person. So why should I make barely more then the average? For the skills I have I should be making twice what the average person makes not a few dollars more. I mean goodness why own a business if I am barely doing better then some average joe? I could have a "normal" job and have less hassle and less stress working for someone else lol.

 

[gunslinger]

I make a lot more than the average person in my town. About 3 times more.

 

[LunchBox]

I make a lot more than the average person in my town. About 3 times more.

I should move to your town and get a slide of that pie. Here in Orange County, California everyone is a FREAKING TECH. I cant get no work here.

 

[camp.cool007]

Back on this thread again?

The way I see it, if you make even just a tiny bit more than the average person, you are doing great. Especially with this economy.

 

[geeksmobileusa]

I should move to your town and get a slide of that pie. Here in Orange County, California everyone is a FREAKING TECH. I cant get no work here.

We had 5 calls in LA last week that we had to reschedule because noone would take them. WHERE WERE YOU THEN!!!!!

 

[bagellad]

I really think everyone should put down their local cost of living on these threads. Since if its costing you $600 a month to live or $2000 a month (CANADIAN DOLLARS) it really changes what you need to charge. I know the people in the united kingdom are paying like 3x for the price of gas. Actually... that makes me think of a good threat to make!!