Charging for Consultations

[PodnutzPro]

I would ask them if they lower their rates for clients that do not want to pay what their standard rate is. Their rate is their rate just as your rate is your rate. It really doesn't matter what their budget is. Did they just pick a number out of thin air and that is now their budget? I don't think I would walk away, but I would ask for prepayment and tell them that is your standard procedure for new clients. I would make it clear that consulting (expertise) = time = money. With all that said, lawyers historically have been some of my worst clients....way too many headaches and I need this NOW demands.....followed by slow pay.

 

[ohio_grad_06]

Pod, only thing wrong about your assessment imo(had this happen with a local company, not a law firm), but especially if they are budget conscious, the FIRST time things go down, they are going to be on the horn. In my case it was not the owner, but keep in mind, we didn't start really taking calls till 10am. This company, one thing was wrong, their accountant was blowing up my phone at like 7:30 or 8 am. We finally recommended they find someone else, made sure they had all the info and walked. The owners were totally cool to deal with,but the accountant, definitely high maintenance. She seemed quick at times to blame our setup vs the fact that hm, maybe the internet may have been down(We'd set up at one point a VPN point to point between their offices).

Also, the op's potential client, to me, if they have that attitude over just consulting, they are going to be a major headache. Op, if you take that client on, take a stopwatch, track from the time you get on their lot till the time you leave with pictures to mark your time. Because first time there is a question about time, I would guess they are going to be hounding you.

 

[PodnutzPro]

Most businesses open at 8AM. If you are going to support businesses, you should also open and start taking calls at 8AM. It is normal for the business to call their IT support when things go down. I don't give out my cell phone to clients, so the only number they have is our office phone, but we do have the phones answered at 8AM and we tell clients that if they call after hours and leave a voicemail that we get that voicemail as an e-mail on our phones. That does not mean that they will get a call back, as after hours response is a best effort only. If they want guaranteed call back after hours, that is extra and if we do call back after hours as a best effort, that time is charged at time and a half.

It is also common for the client to blame their problems on whoever they have on the phone at the time. If she is talking to you, it must be your problem (as they see it). If the ISP support was on the phone first it must be their problem....and so on. I do tell my clients to call me though for any issues. I really don't want them calling the ISP so the ISP can screw up the network by having them do all kinds of crazy tests.

Ohio_grad, in your case I would have spoken to the owners about the accountant's behavior (you may have done this) to see if her attitude could be changed.

When meeting with new clients, we always have a meeting first with the company decision makers(not chargeable, but no work or consulting done) to go over how our company works, company hours, response time, bills, etc. It is during this meeting that we will define the steps going forward. Sometimes the first step is a network evaluation that we charge up front, say $1500.00. This is basically all the discovery that we will need to go forward to support them. If they don't want to pay that, we walk away before any work is actually done. It is true that this client sounds bad, but it is not that uncommon for clients to test you to see what you give up for free or reduced price.

I would not recommend proving what time you were working on their issue. This is definitely not convenient or sustainable. I am quite sure that they do not provide any proof to their clients about times spent working on their issues. There has to be a level of trust. If this is not there, definitely walk away.

 

[callthatgirl]

 

[DataMedics]

+1 For the talks 10min straight flag. Or you could add, leaves a 10 min long voicemail at 9PM griping about how long something is taking, when they've been the cause of the delays the entire time.

 

[ohio_grad_06]

Like that list. Kinda like a guy who called the other day wanting his PC installed and set up that he'd bought. Sure that will be our standard rate of $135 for our tech to come out. "Well I didn't want to pay that much, was thinking more like 75." Red flag. Explain to customer a lot of techs in the area charge $100 an hour or more and we only charge $75 an hour, so we actually are considered reasonable.

IE, if a customer is cheap out of the gate, I don't want to deal with them. I get that people without a lot of money need help too, but it seems like people who are after the lowest prices are the most needy, and I don't have time to chase issues unless there is a legitimate complaint.

 

[satellyte]

Run. Run now. No good can come from this

Agreed. Way too many red flags!

 

[GRAJOE]

I had a referral over to a client from a previous residential client to a Law Office who is going be relocating their offices and wanted help setting up their equipment at the new office. I immediately became suspicious when at the very end of the conversation he mentioned they were on a "really tight budget".

So I give her a call and some more red flags start coming up. She needs her patch panel moved (which honestly sounds like a complete re-wire), and they do not yet have an account with an internet provider because she does not know who services the area as her current ISP doesn't provide service at her new office, and they don't have a phone provider lined up. Then another red flag, they are moving their offices in 6 days.

Sometimes I don't charge for consults, but she and this job sound like it could be a heavily demanding PITA job.

I told her that it's hard to quote how long it would take to setup and make everything perfect at the new office blindly (8 computers, a main printer, setup a new network, and personal printers for all computers). But I told her I would guesstimate probably about 5-6 hours on my end once I've taken all the equipment to the new office, to which I got a long sigh.

I told her I would need to have my wiring guy come out and do an estimate and based on what he has quoted me before I told her probably about $700-$900 and probably half a day, which would include any new equipment recommended or required, to which I got another sigh.

So I explain to her that it would probably be worthwhile to have me come out for an hour or two to help her make some sense of whats going on and give her some direction as to what is going to need to be done, what is going to need to be wired, help her research an ISP and phone provider, and help her get a plan together to make the move as smooth as possible.

"So how much does a consultation cost?"

"Well it's just my normal hourly rate"

She said, well I didn't think we'd have to pay for a consultation so I'll have to check with my partner and see about spending more for a consult.

They are about 30 minutes away, and if I was just popping by to take a quick look I probably wouldn't charge. But this lady has no idea what she is doing, isn't prepared for the move at all in 6 days, has no internet, no phones, no direction, no plan. I just said, "Well how long are you going to be at the new office?"

She says, "At least 5 years, its a 5 year lease."

I just said, "So in my opinion it would probably be a good idea to get someone out there to make sure you have a plan to move, and a plan to make sure you are setup right for the next 5 years, and in my opinion that is worth an hour or two of my time."

Plus I hate going in blind anyways.

So I just think that this job reeks of red flags, and a cheap customer. Sometimes I don't charge for consultations but given how screwed she is, and how it needs to be done two weeks ago, she basically needs someone to come in and line this whole move up for her otherwise she is going to have a hell of a move.

So what do you all think? Do you charge for consults? Would you have charged for this one?

Here's how you manage these types of situations going forward:

Firstly, you've already given a FREE CONSULTATION, that was your time on the phone. Attorneys will fully understand this, as they bill for their time, wherever they are. Next, they're asking for a free estimate. In this situation, that involves an OnSite Survey. There are plenty of businesses that give free estimates, e.g., HVAC contractors, electricians, etc., that will need to come to the perspective customer for this. If that's your policy to get new clients, then do it. If not, advise them because of the distance, time, travel, etc., there is a small Site Survey charge, paid at the time of the visit. If you yourself are doing the survey, charge them. If you subcontract to a wiring/ cable person or company, go with whatever they feel comfortable with. When it comes to cabling, you should have an estimated price per drop that encompasses hardware, labor, etc. Of course there will be exceptions depending on the physical infrastructure of the environment. For example, is an office with a drop ceiling and sheet rock walls? If not, it will cost more.

Using the correct nomenclature and having set policies should be the norm for all businesses, it alleviates the ambivalence. Time is money, and your time is worth money. If you don't elevate and value your services that way, you will fail.

 

[BlackLabTechs]

Funny this topic is brought to the top again. I'm meeting with a lawyer next week (for my needs) and they happen to mention they need some IT services as well. I'm thinking about opening the conversation with "My rates are the same as yours". Then at least we'll both be working for free or we'll be buying each other steak dinners.....

 

[Dustin Hennis]

Depending on your business situation, you should probably walk-away or set documented terms in a contract.

 

[Markverhyden]

Funny this topic is brought to the top again. I'm meeting with a lawyer next week (for my needs) and they happen to mention they need some IT services as well. I'm thinking about opening the conversation with "My rates are the same as yours". Then at least we'll both be working for free or we'll be buying each other steak dinners.....

LOL!!! I'm sure you are being facetious on the rates. At any rate I don't think I'd be willing to engage in barter with a law firm.

 

[BlackLabTechs]

I'm sure you are being facetious on the rates.

Yes, lol. I actually have a pretty good feeling about this one as it's only a 2 lawyer office. One of them has been used by various family members for 30 years and the other just moved here from out of state. She bought a piece of land from my mother to build her house on. I haven't met either one yet but I think it will go pretty well.