What do you guys think about my latest blog post on A+ Certificaiton

[ITTech]

Hello All,
I would like you to read my latest blog post on how IT training schools are preparing students for a career change with a 60 hour A+ certification. I would appreciate some feedback
http://www.careerchangetraining.com/blog/career-change-chicago-a-certification-training-good-luck/

 

[lcoughey]

60 hours, seriously? Wow! I got my A+ in the time and price it took to write the exams back in the mid 90's. Certificates don't mean squat in reality, but are worth a million bucks to the sales team trying to sell your services...mostly because those buying the services don't know that certification does not equal practical knowledge and experience.

 

[Xander]

A+ is like a GED high school diploma. It doesn't prove that you know any practical applications of that learning, just that you've been put through the mill for it. That said, I probably wouldn't consider hiring anyone without it. It shows that they've put that effort into getting a qualification and not just assuming that some experience will be enough.

But, yeah, I got my A+ in the late 90s. Two 3" thick books and I cracked the spine on the hardware one to cram for laser printers....and, of course, not one laser printer question on the test.

 

[TechLady]

The test didn't feel impossibly difficult to me when I took it a few years ago because I had so many years of experience to fall back on, in addition to the reading (which I actually enjoy). That said I'm SO glad I didn't bother taking it in the 90s...the 90s tests sound like they were torture. As were the OSes they were testing you on...

 

[ITTech]

TechLady.. I took my test in the 90s and it actually wasn't that bad. I still see so many students who have zero experience in IT and are placed in a 40 - 60 hour A+ training program. Many do pass the test but they are just "Paper certified" and have a very difficult time finding employment.

If you have experience the test is not very difficult to pass!

 

[Mercenary Roadie]

The A+ is taught in many high schools and its relevance to today's industry is extremely limited. CompTIA has employer's brainwashed to believe those that have it are superior to those that don't.

Personally it's a waste of money and time that can be better spent on more relevant certifications or better yet training.

 

[Martyn]

I never did A+ so cannot comment specifically on that, the article does reinforce that experience is key. I did MCSE and CCNA and whilst I agree it doesn't give you experience I found there were many experienced techs who wouldn't pass the tests. In the real world you'll never get enough experience to pass the tests, it's a fact imho. You have to study specifically for test.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Experience...(aka hands-on)....is definitely huge!

However, IMO...pairing that with some formal education results in an even better set of skills and knowledge. Versus just hands on. It builds a solid foundation to further their education and skills.

Back when Win98 was out...after working in the industry for a few years, my employer at the time sent me to CompTIA for the A+ courses and Network+ course. I already had a few years of "hands on"...and a few years of working with some high end techs. Was probably the most experienced in the class of ~30. I likely could have skipped going to the CompTIA classes and skipped reading the books..and taken the exam cold and Aced it. But I went to the classes, and read the books. I still picked up knowledge. The history of some things, how they developed, etc. I still walked out knowing a little bit more.

(some inside secrets...I did my A+ tests and aced, but the day I went to take my Net+ exam back then...I was walking into the classroom to take my test, and a client called with a big server 911 and I ran out to go to the client...never went back to take my Net+ test!)


Yes, experience can count...so long as it's good experience. Here is a question: "Would you hire someone with no certs...but worked as a tech at Geek Squad for 2 years, or would you hire someone that took A+ and Net+...and appeared to study hard, self taught forum frequenter". That second person may have the potential to run circles around the geek squad tech who only knows how to run a utilities CD and nuke 'n pave computers...leaving device managers with exclamation points!

The term "paper cert"...yeah years ago I used to poke fun at them (well, I guess I still do) Someone that hit up brain dumps...and took and passed the tests, got the certs...but still doesn't really know the material. I've run into plenty of them...and I fully enjoy discovering their weaknesses and putting a spotlight on it. To me...that's lying, or cheating, falsely representing themselves.

Taking these courses can be good, if the person is genuine, goes to the classes, and studies the materials as they should. Just like any education! You can learn from it. And sure..plenty of bad people "slip through"...not paying attention in class, not studying the material, but finding an exam copy at some brain dump and somehow passing the test to get the cert. You'll get that anywhere, in any trade. It's not the fault of CompTIA. It's just a risk you take if you have to hire people.

 

[trevm999]

It look me forever to get through my textbook. I found it impossible to read more than one chapter at a time, even though I found it quite interesting.

Even Geek Squad looks for A+. I had half of my A+ when I applied there and I didn't even get an interview. (For an open position)

After I got my A+ the job offers I got were printer deployment tech, london drugs part-time tech, and sales rep.

 

[BrentfromZulu]

I still think the A+ test is a good way to get your foot in the door. If you are straight out of High School, and want to get a job in IT, that is a good place to start because it shows that the person is interested in getting into the IT field.

If there were 2 people looking for a job, one being a 4 yr college grad with a degree in IT, or a person who is just out of high school who self taught himself to get the A+, I would go with the guy with the A+.

That being said, experience matters the most to me. I have A+ and Net+, but it's really the experience that gets me the jobs (plus, I think I'm a good interviewer)

 

[ITTech]

I def think that A+ Certification has value. The market place demands that most techs have it. It is how the certification is "taught" that I am concerned about. You are suppose to EARN a certification by validating your proven experience and not just cram for it by memorizing facts and passing a few tests.

It all depends on your background and your level of experience. A chef with no experience should never be placed in a 60 hour A+ Training program. Instead the goal should be to gain as much hands-on practice and experience and then preparing for the certification.

Thanks for reading the post! I appreciate it.

 

[ComputerRepairTech]

If you are straight out of High School, and want to get a job in IT, that is a good place to start because it shows that the person is interested in getting into the IT field.

If there were 2 people looking for a job, one being a 4 yr college grad with a degree in IT, or a person who is just out of high school who self taught himself to get the A+, I would go with the guy with the A+.

That being said, experience matters the most to me. I have A+ and Net+, but it's really the experience that gets me the jobs (plus, I think I'm a good interviewer)

Did you just say the following in terms of effort:
Spending 4 years to get a degree in IT < Spending a few weeks studying for A+

Anyone dismissing applicants because of the lack of an A+ cert is making a serious mistake and while doing so is only further supporting the problem.

 

[frederick]

Did you just say the following in terms of effort:
Spending 4 years to get a degree in IT < Spending a few weeks studying for A+

Anyone dismissing applicants because of the lack of an A+ cert is making a serious mistake and while doing so is only further supporting the problem.

I think he was saying the self-taught had been doing this already for a few years, and gots an A+ cert.

If 3 people walked in today looking for a job...
Person A has a 4yr college degree, no experience
Person B has an A+ certification, no experience
Person C has been doing this for X amount of years (not months) and has an A+ (at the minimum), but no degree

Person C would more than likely be hired over the others and start out as a technician. Person A would be looked at as a junior tech, shadowing someone everyday getting really good OJT.

I've had people apply, they got the 4yr degree, but they don't know crap. I've met a lot like this. And when I tell them they are gonna start at the bottom, their bottom gets hurt, and they whine and walk out the door. The one who stuck through it, we paid for his A+ at 6 months, and are now sending him to Net+ to get him started on a higher level of networking than he is at now.

I've had people apply, they got the A+ cert, but they don't know crap...I've shown them the door in a lot of cases. Some we tested them to see what they know, and only 2 actually showed promise, and now they are technicians going out by themselves.

All technical staff is required to have at least an A+. Find my post on how to maintain it without taking it again. These are milestones. If you can't prove you understand the basic theory, I don't want ya. We all get caught up on some easy problems here and there cause we get so used to complicated issues, that we treat the easy ones like a complex one. But I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about the basic theory, and having an A+ shows it. But don't think you are going to go places with just an A+.

 

[ComputerRepairTech]

...person C has experience you are just throwing in A+ just to throw it in there.

You could always ask some of those A+ questions to your applicant...if you can do that with a straight face.

 

[BrentfromZulu]

Did you just say the following in terms of effort:
Spending 4 years to get a degree in IT < Spending a few weeks studying for A+

Anyone dismissing applicants because of the lack of an A+ cert is making a serious mistake and while doing so is only further supporting the problem.

The thing is, there are a lot of airheads that come out of college with that degree and think they are worth a million bucks and they probably don't know how to do a simple tracert. A+ teaches the basics, and it is a lot more focused for computer repair.

I do believe that someone who completed the A+ will be smarter than the guy who got the degree in IT when it comes to computer repair.

 

[frederick]

...person C has experience you are just throwing in A+ just to throw it in there.

You could always ask some of those A+ questions to your applicant...if you can do that with a straight face.

They could have a degree instead of A+. A+ is like taking an intro course into computers in college. That is why it says minimum. They could have college instead of an A+ cert, they could Cisco certs...the thing is they got experience, and they've proved they got the concept/theory down. It's a baseline if you will.

A lot like YeOlde said, hands on is one thing, formal training is another. Combine the two and you got something there that's better than them both. I can't stand strictly book smart. I can't stand strictly street (application) smart either. Those who have the experience but not the formal education tend to take an approach that skips steps or produce extra steps, though in the end they produce amazing work. Those with the education but not the experience get stumped when experiencing a problem not in the text book, making them slower, and sometimes not the best field technicians. That's why I make sure my guys get the OJT, and also get sent to classes, take certs, etc.

In the military my job was 50% On The Job Learn It Yourself, and 50% of satellite and wireless telecommunications classes and the securing of those systems utilizing those technologies... I have a lot of certifications from the government, schools and companies covering all kinds of networking, network security, satellite and wireless telecommunications equipment, but honestly, they only got me so far. I honestly could not have done my job as well I as I did if it wasn't for having both. Most of the instructors only knew what was in the books, same with the contractors they'd send out "fix" the systems. They'd show up and wouldn't know where to start. I'd show up and in 5 minutes it was back up.

 

[BrentfromZulu]

I want to make something clear, because my stance on A+ vs. Degree is a little controversial. If I am right out of High School, and I want to be a computer repair tech, Certs are a good place to start. I personally would've taken any job to get experience, and if I couldn't start on the A+. When 4 years go by, I should have at least a few years of IT experience. Compare that with the guy who just graduated with the degree, I can guarantee I will hire the guy with the experience. Degree means so little to me.

Experience >>>> Certs>> Degree

 

[anonymous Mac Tech]

I want to make something clear, because my stance on A+ vs. Degree is a little controversial. If I am right out of High School, and I want to be a computer repair tech, Certs are a good place to start. I personally would've taken any job to get experience, and if I couldn't start on the A+. When 4 years go by, I should have at least a few years of IT experience. Compare that with the guy who just graduated with the degree, I can guarantee I will hire the guy with the experience. Degree means so little to me.

Experience >>>> Certs>> Degree

Don't take this wrong, but this point of view usually means you haven't earned a degree. Its not about graduating with a degree in IT and instantly configuring DNS, DHCP, a Cisco router, swapping a laptop screen or logic board, etc. Contrary to popular belief, a college degree is not "on the job training." A college degree is the big picture so to speak. I have an IT degree and maybe 35% or less of my coursework included hardcore IT related lab work. There is a reason for this as anything you learn is obsolete in 5 years or less. However, how to solve a quadratic equation, economic theory and principles, or working with keeping the accounting records in the black do not become obsolete. So, you say you would rather just hire the guy with the cert? What about hiring the guy that might start out as you're junior tech and eventually might run your company for you?

 

[frederick]

Don't take this wrong, but this point of view usually means you haven't earned a degree. Its not about graduating with a degree in IT and instantly configuring DNS, DHCP, a Cisco router, swapping a laptop screen or logic board, etc. Contrary to popular belief, a college degree is not "on the job training." A college degree is the big picture so to speak. I have an IT degree and maybe 35% or less of my coursework included hardcore IT related lab work. There is a reason for this as anything you learn is obsolete in 5 years or less. However, how to solve a quadratic equation, economic theory and principles, or working with keeping the accounting records in the black do not become obsolete. So, you say you would rather just hire the guy with the cert? What about hiring the guy that might start out as you're junior tech and eventually might run your company for you?

That is a good point. In a few years, when our college guy has been here for a while, I see him moving up to a more administrative (non-technical as well as technical) position. This is why I'm also very pro-continuing education. Many of us continue to stay in college. I myself am doing that. Adding to ones skills and knowledge set outside of their actual technical profession can only help to improve your self professionally.