'No Fix - No Fee' and a wayward hard drive

[jbartlett323]

I know mhdd can do lots of stuff. What tests/attributes do you use from it to diagnose a failing drive?

Actually, MHDD does pretty much one thing really well: a full surface scan. It has other features, but that's what it is and what it does. If you don't know how to interprete the output though, it can be really hard to use...

 

[lcoughey]

Actually, MHDD does pretty much one thing really well: a full surface scan. It has other features, but that's what it is and what it does. If you don't know how to interprete the output though, it can be really hard to use...

Personally, I find MHDD very simple to use. We use it here to scan and erase all our clone drives before we re-use them for the next project.

 

[jbartlett323]

Oh yes, I do too. But we understand the output. And admittedly its not hard to understand, just the first time I looked at that type of interface I was a little overwhelmed (years ago btw..). Once I knew the proper thresholds to be watching for, what the flashing registers meant, and what the map was telling me, Yeah its super duper easy...

 

[Krynn72]

I also like it because sometimes you can actually "see" the damage to the drive. Like sometimes you can see the "stripe" of damaged sectors as the map goes by. Its like art lol.

Also, while we're talking about it, what does the TONF Acronym stand for? I know the others, but never figured out this one for some reason.

 

[Mainstay]

0: AMNF
1: T0NF
2: ABRT
3: 0
4: IDNF
5: 0
6: UNC
7: BBK

Source: Page 7 of 16 of DeepSparDiskImaging Whitepaper3 as found: http://www.deepspar.com/pdf/DeepSparDiskImagingWhitepaper3.pdf

Bit 0 - Data Address Mark Not Found: During the read sector command, a data address mark was not
found after finding the correct ID field for the requested sector (usually a media error or read instability).
Bit 1 - Track 0 Not Found: Track 0 was not found during drive recalibration.
Bit 2 - Aborted Command: The requested command was aborted due to a device status error.
Bit 3 - Not used (0).
Bit 4 - ID Not Found: The required cylinder, head, and sector could not be found, or an ECC error occurred in the ID
field.
Bit 5 - Not used (0).
Bit 6 - Uncorrectable Data: An ECC error in the data field could not be corrected (a media error or read instability).
Bit 7 - Bad Mark Block: A bad sector mark was found in the ID field of the sector or an Interface CRC error occurred.

 

[pcpete]

If I remember correctly, it would give the amount of time it would take to read sectors. I always thought this may have been a useful criteria for the health of a drive.

 

[sorcerer]

I have to say, if I had to work as a 'no fix no fee' tech, I would have spent - max - 30 mins on diagnostics and then nuke and paved. I dont know how you could make money spending that sort of time on an 'unknown'. The result was an unhappy customer and a dent in your reputation *and* no profit. Whats your time limit on "free" diagnostics? If you dont have one, why not?

Well first of all, this was a regular customer of mine and as I mentioned earlier, she's since been in touch for me to set up her printer and stuff, so I don't think my reputation took a knock, thankfully

More to the point though, it's a bit of an unusual situation at the moment. I'm only doing this job because of health problems (a back injury 20-odd years ago) and I never know if I can manage to work on any given day anyway. I had a triple heart bypass four months ago and although it went well, it's not been without its moments. Then just three weeks ago I had to have another operation - nothing serious and just in and out on the same day so not too bad. However, it's all taking its toll so the doctor suggested a phased return to work and I'm taking his advice. Yes, I did spend more time than would be usual, but then I did have plenty time on my hands to do it

 

[brandonkick]

If I had to do work as a "no-fix, no fee" shop I'd do one of two things:

Refuse any "intermittent" problems (which is hard to do, since your relying on the customer to let you know that)

OR

Draw the line in the sand. If after a day or two worth of efforts you can't find anything, you need to consider
the nuke and pave. Hopefully your rates are in line.

But at some rate, I don't understand. It's not that you couldn't fix it, the customer got tired of waiting it appears
and took it elsewhere. I'm sure that after a few days of not getting anywhere, you would have arrived at the
same place of nuking and paving the thing.

It's a tough call. The customer may have gotten sold a drive they didn't need, but it "fixed" their problem.
It cost you the work because they wouldn't wait, even if they did pay for something they might not have needed.
I guess in that environment, your no worse off then the end result and it comes down to your or him getting paid.
If the customer base and competition has drifted that way, I see little choice on your part. They're going to wind
up at the "no-fix, no fee" shops if you can't "get the job done"... so do the work as you need to do it.

Of course, were only talking about these intermittent things that are only part of the problems you see. I'm not saying
to throw your business quality to the wolves just to be the guy who ends up getting paid. You really don't have to, just
play ball in those special situations.

 

[sapphirescales]

You can't fix what you can't see. Honestly if I can't replicate a problem I go with my gut instinct. I probably would have done the same thing he did and replace the drive and reinstall the OS if I couldn't replicate the problem. As you probably already know, diagnostics aren't always right or conclusive. I tell the client the truth. According to diagnostics, the drive is fine. But my instincts tell me there's an 80% chance that replacing the drive will fix the problem. If it doesn't and you keep having problems, I won't charge you for anything but my time (diagnostics) and trade it in for something else. Then I'd put that computer into a pile that I keep to work on when I've got nothing else to do. Honestly I've learned more from messing around with really weird problems like with that computer than anything else. The only thing that matters is that the client is happy in the end and gets exactly what they need. I do whatever it takes to attain that goal even if I have to take a loss sometimes.

EDIT:
But I only very rarely encounter a problem like this. Maybe a flaky GPU or something. But the fact that it wasn't recording dumps leads me to believe that it's either a RAM or hard drive problem. Of course, software is a big factor too. You shouldn't be getting BSOD's during diagnostics. That implies that you're running diagnostics from within Windows, and that's never a good idea. You can't rule out the software itself as the cause if you're running your diagnostics on the original OS. All of the diagnostic tools I use I launch through Linux or DOS via CD or flash drive. You should never diagnose hardware through the original Windows install on the existing hard drive unless you have no other choice.