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  #21  
Old 01-02-2011, 09:54 PM
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I have to say, I haven't read each and every point made here in this thread, so if what I am about to say has been mentioned, please accept my apologies.

My thoughts are, we are already up to our eyes with government legislation. We do not need any more government departments, looking over our shoulders to ensure we are legit etc..

What I personally think we need, is a group of people, similar to ARCBO, where we as fully legit technicians have to be a member of. This doesn't have to be legislated as such, but we do have to honour simple guidelines, along the lines of,

I agree, I will not remove good known hardware, and replace with substandard, or tell the client x is faulty, when it clearly isnt..

Also, if the client should have a problem with a tech's work, (everything the tech does should be documented), the client could contact the 'body', the 'body' would then look at the merits of the complaint, and if deemed necessary the tech could /should be fined, and or loss of merits..

The main body of the organisation, should be 100% impartial to any and all matters arising, and would know from the work performed by the tech, the notes made, and any questions answered fully, if the complaint should be upheld or not.

By complaints, I don't mean something like, a client saying, I think I was overcharged by 20 ($30), or so. But something like the tech said to me, it would be 2 hours work, at 50 pr hour, and he charged me 6 hours, he didnt inform me as to what was happening, and wanted payment there and then. He wouldn't answer questions as to what was wrong, he just said it needed a reformat, and I lost everything, he didn't ask me if I needed anything backing up..

I think we could do with a large website, of all legitimate repair companies whose credentials are checked, and verified. Where prospective clients could check to see if Joe Bloggs is on there, note they are and know, that they would not be ripped off etc, reviews allowed. This could have a huge branding opportunity. Repair companies, could pay a one off fee, to be on the site, or a regular monthly payment..

Apologies for going round the houses with this, I've been up since 6am working flat out, (its my year end), and i'm shattered and just about to call it a night..
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  #22  
Old 01-02-2011, 10:45 PM
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One of the issues I always had with this industry (at least in my area) is that there are no barriers to entry. Follow your local laws on what's necessary to start a business and you're in. There is nothing in my area that requires someone starting a computer services business to prove they have the necessary skills to provide such service.

A problem I have with CompTIA certifications is that the questions and answers are available online in the form of "practice tests" - actually they're braindumps. There's a few people on this board have admitted using them - they stated after they took their tests "the questions were exactly like the ones in my study material". Well, duh!

Whether they knew their study material were braindumps is open for debate and a subject for another thread. Just pointing why I feel certifications are just about worthless in the real world. However, I am all for some sort of regulation for this industry. Why is it that other service professions require licensing and testing, but the our profession doesn't?

There are also specializations within our industry. I have people ask me to create websites for them. Well, I don't do that type of work and the web developer I have doesn't provide PC repair or networking services. I have to explain to people that if their tooth hurts they don't go to a podiatrist, or if they need a criminal attorney they don't seek a real estate attorney. Our profession has specialties just like other professions. There should be a way for the consumer to know that the person they're hiring has the necessary skill to deliver what they advertise.
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  #23  
Old 01-03-2011, 09:26 AM
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I like idea of a Code of Conduct & Code of Good Practice as practised by the British Computer Society (BCS). The thing is could this sort of thing work as a global standard or would local legislation make this difficult to define?
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  #24  
Old 01-03-2011, 03:16 PM
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Here is why I do not support any government regulation on any level.

Note: this is for the U.S.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Moral Basis of a Free Society
Suppose that a number of farmers or some other economic group desiring to maintain at a high level the price of their crops, goods or services, band together and use force to restrain competition. How can people condemn this as criminal racketeering when done by the group itself, but regard it as a proper exercise of a licensing power when done by their servants in government? Is an act any less evil when done by an agent than when done by the principal? Is the injury to the public any less when government forces prices up than when racketeers do?

Let us assume further that someone has been convicted of violating such a licensing law but there is no proof that he either intended evil or caused anyone harm. He had only tried to make a living in the licensed occupation by producing something which the public needed and was willing to purchase from him. How can any moral person approve of punishing him? And, yet by a curious twist of logic many do. If it is inherently unjust to punish an innocent person, can a man-made law change this fundamental truth? Is a punishment any less harmful and wrong when inflicted by government than when inflicted by a racketeer?

And how can one who thoroughly detests having his own business and private affairs regulated, and who has neither the means nor the least inclination to interfere privately in the affairs of his neighbors - how can he favor laws which send an army of bureaucrats to do this very thing? Is it any less expensive when done through government? Are government employees more competent to operate businesses than the owners themselves?

What is his reason for favoring regulatory laws anyway? Is he fearful that his neighbors, if left to run their own affairs might commit crimes? If so, there are criminal laws to punish them. Is he concerned that if not regulated they might cause someone harm? If so, there are tort and contract laws which permit restitution for every compensable injury. And where did he obtain the authority to regulate his neighbors anyway? And if he does not possess it, how can he delegate it to government? If he undertook it himself, he would likely consider himself either a mental incompetent, an insufferably arrogant busybody or a criminal. How can he fail to view himself in this same light when he acts through government?
And so we never needed more laws or regulations as we always had everything we needed to do the job effectively without adding anything else to the books.
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  #25  
Old 01-03-2011, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAG Computers View Post
Here is why I do not support any government regulation on any level.

Note: this is for the U.S.



And so we never needed more laws or regulations as we always had everything we needed to do the job effectively without adding anything else to the books.
Not one of the best quotes I ever read. That actually asks more questions than it answers. Here, I'll sum it up for you:
Quote:
Don't regulate because it's not hurting anyone and it's the lesser of two evils
There, I was able to to it in less than three paragraphs. Moving on...

Yes, regulation increases pricing, and yes the government isn't a shining example of how to properly implement regulation for the betterment of the industry. That doesn't, however, equate to all regulation being detrimental. Should we abolish the antitrust laws? Should a medical license not be a requirement to practice? Pure capitalism works great when the society lacks evil or selfishness, otherwise, it's flawed.
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  #26  
Old 01-03-2011, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATTech View Post
Not one of the best quotes I ever read. That actually asks more questions than it answers. Here, I'll sum it up for you:

There, I was able to to it in less than three paragraphs. Moving on...

Yes, regulation increases pricing, and yes the government isn't a shining example of how to properly implement regulation for the betterment of the industry. That doesn't, however, equate to all regulation being detrimental. Should we abolish the antitrust laws? Should a medical license not be a requirement to practice? Pure capitalism works great when the society lacks evil or selfishness, otherwise, it's flawed.
Please, if you do not have anything constructive to add to the thread then do not post. I am not here for a flame fest, I am here to discuss things in a calm and rational way. If all you can do is attack me merely on the basis that you disagree then you defeat the purpose of these forums.

Be professional and you will be treated with respect.

No, this is not a flame
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  #27  
Old 01-04-2011, 01:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAG Computers View Post
Please, if you do not have anything constructive to add to the thread then do not post. I am not here for a flame fest, I am here to discuss things in a calm and rational way. If all you can do is attack me merely on the basis that you disagree then you defeat the purpose of these forums.

Be professional and you will be treated with respect.

No, this is not a flame
Hmmm.... Cannot humor be professional? I didn't detect any disrespect or flaming. Besides, it was you who tossed in a political tract written by a person of the cloth.... Religion and politics... how could you NOT expect a sharp reply?

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  #28  
Old 01-04-2011, 04:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAG Computers View Post
Please, if you do not have anything constructive to add to the thread then do not post. I am not here for a flame fest, I am here to discuss things in a calm and rational way. If all you can do is attack me merely on the basis that you disagree then you defeat the purpose of these forums.

Be professional and you will be treated with respect.

No, this is not a flame
In what way was that flaming, un-calm or irrational? I was refuting the validity and substance of the quote, albeit in a sarcastic fashion. Nonetheless, my entire post was constructive, I'm not sure why you're inclined to believe otherwise.

Last edited by ATTech; 01-04-2011 at 05:02 AM.
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  #29  
Old 01-04-2011, 05:36 AM
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Let the markets be free and work themselves out. Is there really anyone here who believes that government regulation would solve any of the problems with bad techs/businesses? I don't believe it would help one single thing for the reasons I posted in my above post.
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  #30  
Old 01-04-2011, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan22 View Post
One of the issues I always had with this industry (at least in my area) is that there are no barriers to entry. Follow your local laws on what's necessary to start a business and you're in. There is nothing in my area that requires someone starting a computer services business to prove they have the necessary skills to provide such service.

A problem I have with CompTIA certifications is that the questions and answers are available online in the form of "practice tests" - actually they're braindumps. There's a few people on this board have admitted using them - they stated after they took their tests "the questions were exactly like the ones in my study material". Well, duh!

Whether they knew their study material were braindumps is open for debate and a subject for another thread. Just pointing why I feel certifications are just about worthless in the real world. However, I am all for some sort of regulation for this industry. Why is it that other service professions require licensing and testing, but the our profession doesn't?

There are also specializations within our industry. I have people ask me to create websites for them. Well, I don't do that type of work and the web developer I have doesn't provide PC repair or networking services. I have to explain to people that if their tooth hurts they don't go to a podiatrist, or if they need a criminal attorney they don't seek a real estate attorney. Our profession has specialties just like other professions. There should be a way for the consumer to know that the person they're hiring has the necessary skill to deliver what they advertise.
Most bad techs get weeded out when they do bad work. Also bad techs help to make good techs look better. Do you know how often I here the quote "My last tech was no ware near as good as you. It always took him twice as long and it was never fixed right" I would have to say at least once or twice a week. Bad techs don't last long in our industry because we thrive or repeat buisness and word of mouth. Regulation will only make the problem worse because our prices would be double what they are now. Most people would rather use an unlicensed pizza tech or buy a new computer.
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